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21st May 2010, 07:22 PM | #1 |
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Since I cannot edit my previous post and seeing that the second picture somewhat disappeared I'm re-uploading the depiction of St. Nicetas from the Gracanica fresco (1321-22)
Thank you both Teodor and Lucian for your knowledgeable (and much needed) insight ! Regards, Samuel |
25th October 2020, 03:50 AM | #2 |
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We must be just a week from Halloween, since I found myself reading an article on this topic. Even sportier is that, as I finished the article, I noticed the author's name looked familiar. I'm quite sure she is a fellow forumites.
Anyway, I wanted to link to the article in this thread for reference. Also, why not resurrect a zombie thread during this witching season? https://heritagearmssa.com/2017/11/1...d-the-impaler/ |
25th October 2020, 05:32 AM | #3 |
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Having read the linked article, in conjunction with this thread, I find a number of her conclusions a bit over-simplified. An example, The conclusion the Kilij was the ancestor of the sabre instead of the other way around. The statement that the short kilij was used by Cavalry instead of a longer shamshir/sabre, not Infantry seems a bit odd to me as well. The UK general's mameluke-like sword has a noticeable and long 'yelman' but does not require a scabbard with an open spine as the blade is not parabolic and is not highly curved. It was adopted after the french invasion of Egypt by Napoleon when the french generals liked them, and the English liked the French version. (UK one below - earlier versions had a brass scabbard, and came with an orderly to keep it polished) It's fairly stabby too. generals of the period would of course never actually need to use a sword in actual combat unless it got really desperate, which would not be often, if they were a good general.
P.s - I thought Shamshire was a county in the UK, not all that far to the southeast from me in Gloucestershire,the other side of Wiltshire, and just south of Berkshire . Last edited by kronckew; 25th October 2020 at 05:48 AM. |
25th October 2020, 04:44 PM | #4 |
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More than you wanted to know about Vlad III:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY82EpsvbQ8 |
1st November 2020, 05:08 PM | #5 |
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Most interesting to see this old thread again Wayne! Its been over a decade, and indeed how appropriate to 'revive' the thoughts of good old Dracula on Halloween!
Actually the article from Heritage arms was I believe by Stuart Bates, Cathey Brimage is the editor of the publication. While a bit tenuous, the topic associating the notorious Vlad with the mameluke saber is of course viable in certain remotely connected facts in some degree. However in most cases such likelihood is about as plausible as the much debated connection between Vlad III (1431-1477) and Bram Stoker's famed vampire. Naturally there are certain possibly connected elements, again in degree. The evolution of sword forms is mostly speculative chronologically, and that of the 'saber' is pretty well veiled. It seems generally held that curved blades evolved somewhere in Central Asia, probably Turkmenistan to give some sort of geographic reference, keeping in mind that the nomadic tribal people of the Steppes were the likely users of them, and around 9th century. It is unclear exactly when this design arose with the Turkic tribes that formed the Ottoman empire, but these were not of course in the manner exactly of the later shamshir types, nor the stout shorter blades with yelman known as 'pala'. It seems that some sort of curved saber (as with falchions in Europe) was in use, but these may have been as with many falchions, straight backed with radiused edge to the point. By the time of Vlad, while there were certainly some type of curved blade swords contemporary, there is no evidence I have ever seen of his using one. I have seen apocryphal sources noting him having a 'Toledo' blade , which in this time would have been of course, a 'knightly' broadsword. We know that straight broadswords were in use in Eastern Europe in these times, but there was a slightly curved version with a kind of 'S' shaped crossguard in use as well. The 'Ottoman' style shamshirs and the similarly hilted 'pala' did not evolve until considerably later, though we know such sabers were in use by 17th century, and the East Europeans, adopted Ottoman styled swords. |
12th October 2022, 08:37 PM | #6 | ||||
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Time for a bit of thread necromancy... Surviving written accounts of individual martial deeds in Wallachian history are rare. These are also, fairly unknown, especially to English speaking audiences. Since most of it is written in Romanian, I hope to add a bit of info here, for non-Romanian speakers.
In addition to written accounts, surviving weapons and iconography are also rare as hen’s teeth. A few notes: by Wallachia, it is implied the medieval state of Wallachia, in historical documents known as “Țara Rumānească” “Ungrovlahia” or “Wallachia Transalpina”. Moldova, although also referred to as “Wallachia” or “Moldo-Vlahia” in certain Polish documents, will be referred to strictly as “Moldova”. Dregator - Historical Romanian ranks and titles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histor...nks_and_titles Jupan - Župan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDupan Stroe Buzescu’s duel with the Tatar (1602) The following is probably the best-known duel (there aren't many known ). In October 1601, after the assassination of Wallachian voievod, Michael the Brave (August 1601), the next to be elected voivode was Radu Șerban. However, his reign was initially, not to be a peaceful one, having to fight-off various rivals. One of these was Simion Movilă, brother to the Moldovan voivode, Ieremia Movilă. At first, Simion Movilă, had to retreat to Moldova, not having the troops to maintain the throne. However, he would return during September 1602, with 40,000 Tatars (commanded by Ğazı II Giray - Khan of the Crimean Khanate.), the Moldovans sent by his brother, Ieremia Movilă, and about 300 Cossacks. Radu Şerban's army was much smaller, totalling around 8,000-10,000 infantrymen and 6,000 horsemen, to which were later added 1,000 horsemen sent from Transylvania by the Habsburg general Giorgio Basta. Considering the numerical superiority of the invaders, Radu Şerban adopted a defensive tactic. The decisive battle took place at Teişani, in the valley of the Teleajen river, on September 23 and 24, 1602. All the Tatar attacks against the Wallachian fortified camp with trenches and palisades failed; in the end, after having suffered great losses, the Tatars had to retreat to Silistra. During the battle of Teişani, the son-in-law or grandson (it’s not known for certain, only named Mārza) of the Crimean Khan had a duel with the Wallachian boyar Stroe Buzescu (also held the title of Mare Stolnic). Whether Stroe or the Tatar was the one who made the challenge, I’m not sure. There are quite a few internet articles written in Romanian, that deal with this event. The basic version of events is this...Stroe Buzescu has a duel with the Tatar, and wins by sword thrust (more on that later). Stroe is generally considered to be an old man during this duel, whereas the Tatar is a young, fit and of great stature. A lot of David vs. Goliath vibes going on here. The thing is that Stroe’s birth date isn’t known, so we don’t know his age for sure. He dies from a sword wound on his face sustained in battle with the Tatar. Commonly, it is said be an infection or the enemy’s sword was poisoned (considering he died 5 weeks later, I’d go with infection). Now for the evidence. As I said, quite a few internet articles are written in Romanian on this duel, however very few cite historical sources. And in my opinion, if something isn’t quoted from a historical source, IT NEVER HAPPENED!. In my opinion, the best free source is “Monumentul funerar īn Țara Romānească – discurs narativ și efigie” by Ioan Albu. The following Romanian texts are exterpts from said work, the English translations are however, my own attempts: Stroe’s wife, Sima Buzescu, commissioned a funeral stone with the following inscription: Quote:
Quote:
In addition to the grave stone, we also have Stroe Buzescu's courage mentioned in a 29 June 1604 chrysobull (hrisov) by Voivode Radu Serban (original in slavonic): Quote:
Quote:
- Stroe (on the right) is using what seems to be a pallash (paloș in RO, pallos in HU, pałasz in PL), deduced by the straight blade, but also the straight scabbard under his leg. The fact that he used it to thrust, and that the scabbard is under his leg, makes me wonder if it was actually a koncerz/hegyestőr - The Tatar is seen dropping his sabre, of fairly typical shape (notice the large yelman). Also besides him, are a recurve bow in holster and a quiver with arrows. Other sources: https://historia.ro/sectiune/actuali...oe-577794.html https://wiki.drajna.ro/doku.php?id=b...in_si_stanesti Last edited by Teisani; 13th October 2022 at 03:45 PM. Reason: Text errors |
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14th October 2022, 02:19 PM | #7 |
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Here are a few pictures I took at the Muzeul Naţional de Artă al Romāniei:
Sf. Gheorghe & Sf. Dumitru (nice details on the composite bow). Painting atributed to master painter Dobromir, 1526, from the Curtea de Argeș monastery's church. |
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