Opinions on reproduction turkish (or persian?) dagger

dakary · 12th September 2023, 02:32 AM

Hi everybody,

I know that a lot of the discussion here focuses on antiques, but I am really hoping that I am allowed to ask about a modern reproduction. If I am not, please accept my apologies.

I commissioned a sword maker who specializes in Turkish swords to make me a sword (kilij) and a dagger. He doesn't normally make daggers (he focuses on swords). I said that I wanted something ottoman and 15th century but we had trouble finding things. We did manage to find some 16th century daggers, with the understanding that there probably wouldn't be a huge difference - so I agreed on that.

I have attached a picture of what he sent me. It doesn't look much like anything I sent him or he sent me. I want to get your opinions on it. I think it is cool, and really well made, but I am worried that it is a fantasy piece and that I can't legitimately call this a historical reproduction. However, this order of the sword and dagger was my first dip into the middle eastern reproduction market (I typically dabble in 15th century Europe, or - to a lesser degree - 18th century North America) so maybe I'm wrong and it is fine from a historical perspective.

Here are my concerns with it:

1. The handle silhouette shape seems plausible (Persian?), but I am not sure about the flattened octagon handle. I wonder if it shouldn't be oval instead, or have more sides to it.
2. I am not sure about the riveted handle. I am wondering if this shouldn't be peened.
3. I am not sure about the side rings. Weren't these just tucked into a belt without rings, hooks, etc?
4. I am not sure about this lacking a chape. Shouldn't there be a chape over the leather, or under the leather with a ball sticking out? Were these ever without a chape?
5. I am not sure about the direction of the point. When wearing it in front, the curve goes left. Shouldn't it curve right?
6. Is wood something that was used for this sort of dagger handle/hilt?

I'll admit my total ignorance here (I hope these aren't dumb questions), and I really would appreciate some help and an education. Thank you so much!

12th September 2023, 02:32 AM	#1
dakary Member Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Canada Posts: 26	Opinions on reproduction turkish (or persian?) dagger Hi everybody, I know that a lot of the discussion here focuses on antiques, but I am really hoping that I am allowed to ask about a modern reproduction. If I am not, please accept my apologies. I commissioned a sword maker who specializes in Turkish swords to make me a sword (kilij) and a dagger. He doesn't normally make daggers (he focuses on swords). I said that I wanted something ottoman and 15th century but we had trouble finding things. We did manage to find some 16th century daggers, with the understanding that there probably wouldn't be a huge difference - so I agreed on that. I have attached a picture of what he sent me. It doesn't look much like anything I sent him or he sent me. I want to get your opinions on it. I think it is cool, and really well made, but I am worried that it is a fantasy piece and that I can't legitimately call this a historical reproduction. However, this order of the sword and dagger was my first dip into the middle eastern reproduction market (I typically dabble in 15th century Europe, or - to a lesser degree - 18th century North America) so maybe I'm wrong and it is fine from a historical perspective. Here are my concerns with it: 1. The handle silhouette shape seems plausible (Persian?), but I am not sure about the flattened octagon handle. I wonder if it shouldn't be oval instead, or have more sides to it. 2. I am not sure about the riveted handle. I am wondering if this shouldn't be peened. 3. I am not sure about the side rings. Weren't these just tucked into a belt without rings, hooks, etc? 4. I am not sure about this lacking a chape. Shouldn't there be a chape over the leather, or under the leather with a ball sticking out? Were these ever without a chape? 5. I am not sure about the direction of the point. When wearing it in front, the curve goes left. Shouldn't it curve right? 6. Is wood something that was used for this sort of dagger handle/hilt? I'll admit my total ignorance here (I hope these aren't dumb questions), and I really would appreciate some help and an education. Thank you so much! Attached Images