An Italian Bill (Roncone) for comment

[fernando]

What are your thoughts now ...Guy ?. By the way, does this Roncone belong in your collection ?

[BUCC_Guy]

I am working on getting it shipped, so it isn’t in my possession yet.

I usually try to match up construction styles for polearms with existing examples. Aside from some notable orders, like Sempach halberds, most polearms differ a little bit.

I am looking for other examples of this particular bill style, as the only one I could find online was posted above.

What stinks is I have seen this particular bill style before, I just can’t find photos.

[fernando]

Say Guy, have you opened the link to my roncone example, per my posted #2 ?
Is the one you are about to import still complete with its whole haft ? When i had mine shipped from Italy, its (square section) pole was sawn in two halves, for shipping conveniences. The cut off part was included in the package, although this wouldn't represent such loss, as the haft was not the original.
Speaking of Sempach typology, have you any example of such halberds ?

[BUCC_Guy]

Originally Posted by fernando

Say Guy, have you opened the link to my roncone example, per my posted #2 ?
Is the one you are about to import still complete with its whole haft ? When i had mine shipped from Italy, its (square section) pole was sawn in two halves, for shipping conveniences. The cut off part was included in the package, although this wouldn't represent such loss, as the haft was not the original.
Speaking of Sempach typology, have you any example of such halberds ?

I actually saw your thread before I even posted this thread. I liked it.

I am opting to not cut the haft, even though it is not original. I don’t want to have to deal with repairing it. It is very long and a repair is more likely to break. This example is already in the U.S., and it is 2.92 meters, so I am paying a lot for transport.

I shipped four uncut polearms from Italy for less than this one polearm!

[BUCC_Guy]

Updating thread with new pictures.

While roncones (bisarmas, rosschinders, bills) usually follow the same pattern in Italy, there’s a few notable trends. I’ll reference the numbered examples in the first picture.

1) The blade below the hook usually bulges out. I call this the “belly.” Some are more pronounced (#8) and some are more rounded (#7)
2) The main front spear is either a spike (diamond cross-section, slightly wider than the blade, like #7, #9, and mine) or an extension of the blade, being the same thickness but possibly reinforced further up (#8).
3) The same type of spike construction can apply to the rear spike as well, although all of the examples in the picture are of the wider, flatter blade type, mine is the diamond cross-section type.
4) The hook itself can very in length (extending out from the main blade) and stoutness.


What makes mine unusual is the angle of the hook, as it is almost a right angle and does not curve downward much. I posted the only dated example I could find in the original post, and I’ll keep looking for more.

I bought this roncone because I needed one for my collection and it is a very impressive size. However, I find #8 to be the most attractive form. Thomas Del Mar sold a number of great examples years ago.


Attached are some pictures showing the closer details.

I am debating cleaning it. I generally do not touch my antique metals if there is no active rust, but a gentle rub with oil couldn’t hurt anything aside from my emotions.

[BUCC_Guy]

Stumbled upon another example sold at Bonhams, described as early part of the 16th century.

Similar hook and spike as mine, but a weaker socket area, and the spike is not in line with the haft (which I find unappealing both artistically and if I wanted to stab someone.)

[Victrix]

Originally Posted by BUCC_Guy

I actually saw your thread before I even posted this thread. I liked it.

I am opting to not cut the haft, even though it is not original. I don’t want to have to deal with repairing it. It is very long and a repair is more likely to break. This example is already in the U.S., and it is 2.92 meters, so I am paying a lot for transport.

I shipped four uncut polearms from Italy for less than this one polearm!

Yes a word of warning on this. I paid several hundred USD for transport of a halberd from Austria to Sweden. The transport cost almost as much as the item itself. If it hadn’t been for the pandemic I would have traveled down there myself to bring it home!

It was packed in a 3m long solid wooden crate by the packing company even though the haft is not original which was pointed out to them. I think the package weighted 40kg and I could only lift one end and drag it on the ground. I needed a special L shaped tool to remove the special screws manually to open the crate. Luckily I managed to open one end to pull out the halberd from the crate. Then I had to dispose of the crate which took some thinking as I live in central Stockholm.

How did the Italians package the polearms?

[BUCC_Guy]

Originally Posted by Victrix

Yes a word of warning on this. I paid several hundred USD for transport of a halberd from Austria to Sweden. The transport cost almost as much as the item itself. If it hadn’t been for the pandemic I would have traveled down there myself to bring it home!

It was packed in a 3m long solid wooden crate by the packing company even though the haft is not original which was pointed out to them. I think the package weighted 40kg and I could only lift one end and drag it on the ground. I needed a special L shaped tool to remove the special screws manually to open the crate. Luckily I managed to open one end to pull out the halberd from the crate. Then I had to dispose of the crate which took some thinking as I live in central Stockholm.

How did the Italians package the polearms?

I feel your pain! Heavy and awkward, but very sturdy. I also lived in the middle of a city at the time and had to buy a saw just to destroy the crate. Plus, I had to pay a building staff member to bring it up to my condo.