Pallash for comments

Jim McDougall · 5th March 2005, 02:50 AM

Hello Adam,
Extremely impressive entry post!! Welcome to the forum. Its great to have another addition to the contingent of Eastern European Hussars here

!
For many years the arms and armour of Poland, Hungary, Romania and this sector of Europe have been obscure in arms references and considered exotica that could only be admired in museums and esoteric books. It is wonderful to have members from these countries who can share information in discussions on these and especially those who actually have examples in thier collections.
This example you show in the very exciting array of sabres is most intriguing.
The hilt does reflect the general form of Polish sabres from late 17th through 18th centuries in the perpandicular dynamics of the guard, especially the extended straight quillon, and the elongated rectangular langet( similar forms are seen in Zygulski's "Stara Bron" Warsaw, 1982, p.46) The integrated pommel and backstrap also reflect hilts of Polish form in that period.
The hilt on your example is quite heavy and somewhat interpretive, suggesting the latter part of the period described. What is most interesting is of course the blade. I have honestly never seen a blade of this heavy straight form mounted in this type hilt. I am very curious about the rounded tip as well, which as discussed suggests an execution weapon, although these examples would not have required a knuckleguard and it seems they always had simple cross type hilts.
Wolviex: could you possibly say more on these pallasches with rounded blades for chopping action? The use of the estoc (koncerz) for armor piercing thrusts is clear, but the use of such chopping action is puzzling. I have heard of unusually large swords such as two handed forms used to bring down horse and rider...could this have been the purpose of this unusually large sword?

Adam: Could you show closeups of the facing moons and the shield with T and dot? As noted, these do suggest Solingen manufacture. It is well known that Solingen makers typically used established and known markings from other makers and centers. The 'T' of course suggested Toledo, and the only thing thus far I have found with T and dot is Aguirre Hortuna de Nicholas of Toledo, 16th century ("Armourers Markings" Gyngell, p.81). The facing moons are interesting because these showed up as is well known on the takoubas and many kaskaras in North Africa, and it is well known that many if not most trade blades came from Germany. In studying the takouba, it is interesting to note that the native blades often have a rounded tip. Possibly a reflection of German trade blade influence, and these type blades?

Could we see more of the blade, especially the point? What is the length of the blade in inches ( no rulers with cm. out here in Texas !!)

All the best,
Jim

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5th March 2005, 02:50 AM	#9
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,298	Hello Adam, Extremely impressive entry post!! Welcome to the forum. Its great to have another addition to the contingent of Eastern European Hussars here ! For many years the arms and armour of Poland, Hungary, Romania and this sector of Europe have been obscure in arms references and considered exotica that could only be admired in museums and esoteric books. It is wonderful to have members from these countries who can share information in discussions on these and especially those who actually have examples in thier collections. This example you show in the very exciting array of sabres is most intriguing. The hilt does reflect the general form of Polish sabres from late 17th through 18th centuries in the perpandicular dynamics of the guard, especially the extended straight quillon, and the elongated rectangular langet( similar forms are seen in Zygulski's "Stara Bron" Warsaw, 1982, p.46) The integrated pommel and backstrap also reflect hilts of Polish form in that period. The hilt on your example is quite heavy and somewhat interpretive, suggesting the latter part of the period described. What is most interesting is of course the blade. I have honestly never seen a blade of this heavy straight form mounted in this type hilt. I am very curious about the rounded tip as well, which as discussed suggests an execution weapon, although these examples would not have required a knuckleguard and it seems they always had simple cross type hilts. Wolviex: could you possibly say more on these pallasches with rounded blades for chopping action? The use of the estoc (koncerz) for armor piercing thrusts is clear, but the use of such chopping action is puzzling. I have heard of unusually large swords such as two handed forms used to bring down horse and rider...could this have been the purpose of this unusually large sword? Adam: Could you show closeups of the facing moons and the shield with T and dot? As noted, these do suggest Solingen manufacture. It is well known that Solingen makers typically used established and known markings from other makers and centers. The 'T' of course suggested Toledo, and the only thing thus far I have found with T and dot is Aguirre Hortuna de Nicholas of Toledo, 16th century ("Armourers Markings" Gyngell, p.81). The facing moons are interesting because these showed up as is well known on the takoubas and many kaskaras in North Africa, and it is well known that many if not most trade blades came from Germany. In studying the takouba, it is interesting to note that the native blades often have a rounded tip. Possibly a reflection of German trade blade influence, and these type blades? Could we see more of the blade, especially the point? What is the length of the blade in inches ( no rulers with cm. out here in Texas !!) All the best, Jim