Rare Dayak Daggers - Sadop and Dohong

VVV · 17th November 2006, 07:34 AM

Thanks Albert and Arjan,

Why isn't 781-104 among the other Bayu in Juynboll but placed among the transition swords to Mandau? Doesn't the blade follow the regular Bayu shape?

There is one additional Bayu in the picture archive as well as Juynboll, 659-87. It's unfortunately hard to see the details of its wooden hilt (it's the one classified as Bejadju).
Also, in my version, the German one (I assume you have the Dutch version?), on page 238 (the last sword before Latok starts), there is referred to "E.C.V. 90" instead of a regular catalogue number.
Do you kow what that means and how to find the picture of this 4th Bayu?

Michael

Dajak · 18th November 2006, 05:06 AM

HI Albert and don t forget there is a lot off missing off the collection in Leiden
i heard from someone that has been there for his study that a lot off objects might been stolen or disappear .

THERE WAS AN INVESTIGATION BUT THEY STOPPED THIS BECAUSE TO MUCH MISSING .

Ben

tom hyle · 18th November 2006, 11:25 PM

These spearpoint (bayu?) madaus do not (except for the one in hte b&w pic) seem to be truly double edged, but to have a false edge bevelled more for thrusting than for cutting?
The wide triangular dagger bears an interesting resemblance to modern Moro gunongs/punals, as does the narrow dagger to tombaks and tombak daggers.

Dajak · 19th November 2006, 10:37 AM

Hi Tom these mandau s are no spearpoints and they are double edged
some have one side hollow flat other side same hollow flat like the normal
parang ihlang . they are very sharp both sides.

Ben

tom hyle · 4th December 2006, 07:23 PM

You misunderstand me. THe term spearpoint is used by N American cutlers (etc.) to designate a blade with a symetrically centralized point.

asomotif · 16th February 2007, 02:16 PM

A friend has this spear in his collection (well actually in a corner of his cellar, but he is sadly not considering to let it go

)

take a look at the dohong in Zonneveld's, the decoration at the base, the way the sides are sharpened only from one side of the blade.
This blade seems very much a spearhead to me, but the dohong in Zonneveld is now a puzzle to me. is it a dagger or a spearhead hilted as a dagger

VVV · 17th February 2007, 05:14 PM

Hi Willem,

I also believe that some of the Dohong are remounted spearheads.
And then there seems to be another version which is more like a sword blade
(maybe ancestor of the Bayu?).
Probably Dohong is several, actually different, versions of old (pre 20th C) double-edged Dayak blades grouped together as one classification?

Michael

Dajak · 17th February 2007, 08:57 PM

Hi Michael and Willem this is not an Dohun Michael you see also an very big
spearhead in Kopenhagen the Dayaks have very big spear heads but don t make them dohun s

Ben

VVV · 17th February 2007, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dajak

Hi Michael and Willem this is not an Dohun Michael you see also an very big
spearhead in Kopenhagen the Dayaks have very big spear heads but don t make them dohun s

Ben

Hi Ben,

No I don't think that Willem's example is a Dohong.
But I suspect that some of the Dohongs were made of old spear heads.
Like f.i. the version below that are both found as spear heads and mounted as a Dohong.
Or maybe it's the Dohong blades that are mounted as spears as well?

Michael

Albert · 18th February 2007, 05:27 PM

Hello Michael,

Interesting photo!
From which publication is it?

Albert

Dajak · 17th February 2007, 09:44 PM

Here some pics

Ben

16th February 2007, 02:16 PM	#6
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	BORNEO SPEAR RESEMBLING A DOHONG A friend has this spear in his collection (well actually in a corner of his cellar, but he is sadly not considering to let it go ) take a look at the dohong in Zonneveld's, the decoration at the base, the way the sides are sharpened only from one side of the blade. This blade seems very much a spearhead to me, but the dohong in Zonneveld is now a puzzle to me. is it a dagger or a spearhead hilted as a dagger Attached Images

17th February 2007, 09:44 PM	#11
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Here some pics Ben Attached Images

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17th November 2006, 07:34 AM	#1
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Thanks Albert and Arjan, Why isn't 781-104 among the other Bayu in Juynboll but placed among the transition swords to Mandau? Doesn't the blade follow the regular Bayu shape? There is one additional Bayu in the picture archive as well as Juynboll, 659-87. It's unfortunately hard to see the details of its wooden hilt (it's the one classified as Bejadju). Also, in my version, the German one (I assume you have the Dutch version?), on page 238 (the last sword before Latok starts), there is referred to "E.C.V. 90" instead of a regular catalogue number. Do you kow what that means and how to find the picture of this 4th Bayu? Michael

18th November 2006, 05:06 AM	#2
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	HI Albert and don t forget there is a lot off missing off the collection in Leiden i heard from someone that has been there for his study that a lot off objects might been stolen or disappear . THERE WAS AN INVESTIGATION BUT THEY STOPPED THIS BECAUSE TO MUCH MISSING . Ben

18th November 2006, 11:25 PM	#3
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	These spearpoint (bayu?) madaus do not (except for the one in hte b&w pic) seem to be truly double edged, but to have a false edge bevelled more for thrusting than for cutting? The wide triangular dagger bears an interesting resemblance to modern Moro gunongs/punals, as does the narrow dagger to tombaks and tombak daggers.

19th November 2006, 10:37 AM	#4
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Tom these mandau s are no spearpoints and they are double edged some have one side hollow flat other side same hollow flat like the normal parang ihlang . they are very sharp both sides. Ben

4th December 2006, 07:23 PM	#5
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	You misunderstand me. THe term spearpoint is used by N American cutlers (etc.) to designate a blade with a symetrically centralized point.

17th February 2007, 05:14 PM	#7
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Willem, I also believe that some of the Dohong are remounted spearheads. And then there seems to be another version which is more like a sword blade (maybe ancestor of the Bayu?). Probably Dohong is several, actually different, versions of old (pre 20th C) double-edged Dayak blades grouped together as one classification? Michael

17th February 2007, 08:57 PM	#8
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael and Willem this is not an Dohun Michael you see also an very big spearhead in Kopenhagen the Dayaks have very big spear heads but don t make them dohun s Ben

18th February 2007, 05:27 PM	#10
Albert Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 205	Hello Michael, Interesting photo! From which publication is it? Albert