Rare Dayak Daggers - Sadop and Dohong

Mytribalworld · 16th November 2006, 06:18 PM

Hi Ben,

one ( 16-284 ) is a very early collected piece came in to the museum around 1860 but was from the journey of Salomon Muller who visited Borneo in 1836.
Salomon visited the south of Borneo the aria upriver Barito from Banjarmassin.
In his book there's one time that he mentioned " we bought some chickens and other food,some mats,weaponery and jewellery" in the village Lontontoer.So its possible that he obtained this Bayu there.

the other (781-04) I'm not for sure but the number is from just before 1900.
the handle looks almost chinese and the scabbard has a " never used patina".

Arjan.

Albert · 16th November 2006, 10:26 PM

Some additional information that may be helpful: 781-104 (781-04 does not exist) is, according to Juynboll, called a pisau poelang banaga (sword with a hilt with a naga). It has been collected in South-East Borneo by Mr. W.E.M.S. Aernout and has come into the collection of the museum in 1890, from his legacy.

Albert

VVV · 17th November 2006, 07:34 AM

Thanks Albert and Arjan,

Why isn't 781-104 among the other Bayu in Juynboll but placed among the transition swords to Mandau? Doesn't the blade follow the regular Bayu shape?

There is one additional Bayu in the picture archive as well as Juynboll, 659-87. It's unfortunately hard to see the details of its wooden hilt (it's the one classified as Bejadju).
Also, in my version, the German one (I assume you have the Dutch version?), on page 238 (the last sword before Latok starts), there is referred to "E.C.V. 90" instead of a regular catalogue number.
Do you kow what that means and how to find the picture of this 4th Bayu?

Michael

Dajak · 18th November 2006, 05:06 AM

HI Albert and don t forget there is a lot off missing off the collection in Leiden
i heard from someone that has been there for his study that a lot off objects might been stolen or disappear .

THERE WAS AN INVESTIGATION BUT THEY STOPPED THIS BECAUSE TO MUCH MISSING .

Ben

tom hyle · 18th November 2006, 11:25 PM

These spearpoint (bayu?) madaus do not (except for the one in hte b&w pic) seem to be truly double edged, but to have a false edge bevelled more for thrusting than for cutting?
The wide triangular dagger bears an interesting resemblance to modern Moro gunongs/punals, as does the narrow dagger to tombaks and tombak daggers.

Dajak · 19th November 2006, 10:37 AM

Hi Tom these mandau s are no spearpoints and they are double edged
some have one side hollow flat other side same hollow flat like the normal
parang ihlang . they are very sharp both sides.

Ben

tom hyle · 4th December 2006, 07:23 PM

You misunderstand me. THe term spearpoint is used by N American cutlers (etc.) to designate a blade with a symetrically centralized point.

asomotif · 16th February 2007, 02:16 PM

A friend has this spear in his collection (well actually in a corner of his cellar, but he is sadly not considering to let it go

)

take a look at the dohong in Zonneveld's, the decoration at the base, the way the sides are sharpened only from one side of the blade.
This blade seems very much a spearhead to me, but the dohong in Zonneveld is now a puzzle to me. is it a dagger or a spearhead hilted as a dagger

VVV · 17th February 2007, 05:14 PM

Hi Willem,

I also believe that some of the Dohong are remounted spearheads.
And then there seems to be another version which is more like a sword blade
(maybe ancestor of the Bayu?).
Probably Dohong is several, actually different, versions of old (pre 20th C) double-edged Dayak blades grouped together as one classification?

Michael

Dajak · 17th February 2007, 08:57 PM

Hi Michael and Willem this is not an Dohun Michael you see also an very big
spearhead in Kopenhagen the Dayaks have very big spear heads but don t make them dohun s

Ben

Dajak · 17th February 2007, 09:44 PM

Here some pics

Ben

16th February 2007, 02:16 PM	#8
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	BORNEO SPEAR RESEMBLING A DOHONG A friend has this spear in his collection (well actually in a corner of his cellar, but he is sadly not considering to let it go ) take a look at the dohong in Zonneveld's, the decoration at the base, the way the sides are sharpened only from one side of the blade. This blade seems very much a spearhead to me, but the dohong in Zonneveld is now a puzzle to me. is it a dagger or a spearhead hilted as a dagger Attached Images

17th February 2007, 09:44 PM	#11
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Here some pics Ben Attached Images

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16th November 2006, 06:18 PM	#1
Mytribalworld Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 400	Hi Ben, one ( 16-284 ) is a very early collected piece came in to the museum around 1860 but was from the journey of Salomon Muller who visited Borneo in 1836. Salomon visited the south of Borneo the aria upriver Barito from Banjarmassin. In his book there's one time that he mentioned " we bought some chickens and other food,some mats,weaponery and jewellery" in the village Lontontoer.So its possible that he obtained this Bayu there. the other (781-04) I'm not for sure but the number is from just before 1900. the handle looks almost chinese and the scabbard has a " never used patina". Arjan.

16th November 2006, 10:26 PM	#2
Albert Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 205	Some additional information that may be helpful: 781-104 (781-04 does not exist) is, according to Juynboll, called a pisau poelang banaga (sword with a hilt with a naga). It has been collected in South-East Borneo by Mr. W.E.M.S. Aernout and has come into the collection of the museum in 1890, from his legacy. Albert

17th November 2006, 07:34 AM	#3
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Thanks Albert and Arjan, Why isn't 781-104 among the other Bayu in Juynboll but placed among the transition swords to Mandau? Doesn't the blade follow the regular Bayu shape? There is one additional Bayu in the picture archive as well as Juynboll, 659-87. It's unfortunately hard to see the details of its wooden hilt (it's the one classified as Bejadju). Also, in my version, the German one (I assume you have the Dutch version?), on page 238 (the last sword before Latok starts), there is referred to "E.C.V. 90" instead of a regular catalogue number. Do you kow what that means and how to find the picture of this 4th Bayu? Michael

18th November 2006, 05:06 AM	#4
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	HI Albert and don t forget there is a lot off missing off the collection in Leiden i heard from someone that has been there for his study that a lot off objects might been stolen or disappear . THERE WAS AN INVESTIGATION BUT THEY STOPPED THIS BECAUSE TO MUCH MISSING . Ben

18th November 2006, 11:25 PM	#5
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	These spearpoint (bayu?) madaus do not (except for the one in hte b&w pic) seem to be truly double edged, but to have a false edge bevelled more for thrusting than for cutting? The wide triangular dagger bears an interesting resemblance to modern Moro gunongs/punals, as does the narrow dagger to tombaks and tombak daggers.

19th November 2006, 10:37 AM	#6
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Tom these mandau s are no spearpoints and they are double edged some have one side hollow flat other side same hollow flat like the normal parang ihlang . they are very sharp both sides. Ben

4th December 2006, 07:23 PM	#7
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	You misunderstand me. THe term spearpoint is used by N American cutlers (etc.) to designate a blade with a symetrically centralized point.

17th February 2007, 05:14 PM	#9
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Willem, I also believe that some of the Dohong are remounted spearheads. And then there seems to be another version which is more like a sword blade (maybe ancestor of the Bayu?). Probably Dohong is several, actually different, versions of old (pre 20th C) double-edged Dayak blades grouped together as one classification? Michael

17th February 2007, 08:57 PM	#10
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael and Willem this is not an Dohun Michael you see also an very big spearhead in Kopenhagen the Dayaks have very big spear heads but don t make them dohun s Ben