THE ENGLISH LONG BOW.

[fernando]

I wonder if the illustration of the various types of arrows shown in post #4 reflect the type's used in Long Bow arrows.
It is written that, those were mostly the Bodkin type, of heavy pointy square cross section, with great perforation power. Therefore, this type of arrow was used against heavy infantry or short-range cavalry. It is said that, these arrows were very effective against chainmail, however, they could bounce off plate armor if they didn't land perpendicular to the surface. They were relatively 'standardized' and mass produced; between 400,000 and 800,000 arrows were needed for a campaign.
The 3,500 arrows found in the wreckage of the Mary Rose measure between 61 and 81 cm (76 cm on average) and are cut from poplar or ash.



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[fernando]

The Long Bow in action in Shrewsbury (1403) and the skills of John Bradmore.


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[kai]

Of course, the Asian compound bow also needs to be mentioned as a highly advanced distance weapon for military use.

Also the ancient method of javelin/"dart" plus "spear" thrower tends to be overlooked as an extremely efficient long-range projectile!

Regards,
Kai

[Peter Hudson]

Of course, the Asian compound bow also needs to be mentioned as a highly advanced distance weapon for military use.

Hello Kai, Indeed my bow is a Korean Short Bow and I have that in mind as well as Turkish and others. Im not sure about darts and Javelins etc and that could be another subject...although Border Rievers carried a Latch which was a small crossbow that fired a small arrow like a dart almost...
Regards Peter Hudson.

[Peter Hudson]

The question a lot of people ask is what is the furthest an arrow can be fired... The answer is that the Turkish Footbow appears to have that record... and this can be viewed at https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-l...medieval-times

The weapon fires an extraordinary arrow which has no feathers and is much thicker in the middle ... rather like an aircraft fusilage and a remarkable and aerodynamic design for its day.

[Peter Hudson]

Purely by coincidence a separate and up to now unexplored effect on piercing armour with arrows...on page 109 of The Reivers by Alistair Moffat "2017" Incoming arrows from English and Welsh bowmen at Agincourt while only slightly piercing the armour caused such agony as to force the French Knights to dismount and tear off the breast plate armour in the heat of battle...

This must have had a disastrous effect and a virtual pile up amidst deep muddy terrain and bang in front of the English line of defence.. in the killing zone.

Peter Hudson.

[Peter Hudson]

At Crecy another disaster for The French... This was probably inspired by the speed of the draw which for the English and or Welsh Bow men was about 20 a minute...five times faster than the French.

I am reminded that English Archers stuck their arrows in the ground ready to fire and here is another reminder of the lethality of the weapon...the point covered in earth was thus full of bacteria and made the damage to the enemy far worse.

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Peter Hudson

The question a lot of people ask is what is the furthest an arrow can be fired... The answer is that the Turkish Footbow appears to have that record... and this can be viewed at https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-l...medieval-times

The weapon fires an extraordinary arrow which has no feathers and is much thicker in the middle ... rather like an aircraft fusilage and a remarkable and aerodynamic design for its day.

I realize that, to reach such extraordinary distances, an arrow requires a bow of dimensions greater than the one in the (quora) picture, even being the Turkish type.
Speaking of foot bows, i wonder whether the South American variant has connections with the Asian counterpart.
And speaking of long bows as per the term, remember the variant used by the Sirionó people of Eastern Colombia. Varying in size, depending upon the hunter, are all long, perhaps the longest in the world. On the average they range between 7 and 9 feet in length, although one was seen that measured 9 feet 7 inches. The Indians themselves have no explanation of why they use such a long bow, other than to say they were taught to do so by their fathers. They assert, however, that a short bow is no good. The explanation is probably to be sought in the manner in which the Sirionó use the bow in shooting. It is bent to the maximum distance allowed by the arms before the arrow is released. If a short bow were used, it is likely that the wood could not withstand the strain of the pull or that the hunter would not have sufficient strength to bend it to the desired degree.


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[Peter Hudson]

Originally Posted by fernando

The Long Bow in action in Shrewsbury (1403) and the skills of John Bradmore.


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Yes interesting bit of kit... Please see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LYeyO3Oa8o for a video covering the mediaeval surgical removal of arrowheads.

Peter Hudson.

[urbanspaceman]

This is a fascinating and much overlooked subject Peter, well-done for establishing this thread.
I am slowly working my way through the various links posted... thank-you.

[Peter Hudson]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

This is a fascinating and much overlooked subject Peter, well-done for establishing this thread.
I am slowly working my way through the various links posted... thank-you.

Hello Kieth, Yes it is fascinating... and if you get a spare moment look at how Lars Anderson sees the Archery game. See https://www.google.com/search?q=arch...hrome&ie=UTF-8 Essentially he throws away the rule book and goes back to basic principles ... Regards Peter.

[Peter Hudson]

Hello all, It does seem that greasing the arrow shaft has some effect on arrow penetration. Tod goes on to experiment with arrows against various shields ... I should try to download one of his excellent video demonstrations on this subject.

Peter Hudson.

[Edward C.]

Were the bodkin points hardened ? As a amateur metal worker I would think that would be key to getting an initial "bite" on plate armor, so it would not skid off on an oblique impact.

[Peter Hudson]

Originally Posted by fernando

I wonder if the illustration of the various types of arrows shown in post #4 reflect the type's used in Long Bow arrows.
It is written that, those were mostly the Bodkin type, of heavy pointy square cross section, with great perforation power. Therefore, this type of arrow was used against heavy infantry or short-range cavalry. It is said that, these arrows were very effective against chainmail, however, they could bounce off plate armor if they didn't land perpendicular to the surface. They were relatively 'standardized' and mass produced; between 400,000 and 800,000 arrows were needed for a campaign.
The 3,500 arrows found in the wreckage of the Mary Rose measure between 61 and 81 cm (76 cm on average) and are cut from poplar or ash.



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Indeed the Bodkin ... Probably the least expensive and best overall performer seen here in the English box below with 8 other variants and in the bigger box European variants. Peter Hudson.

[werecow]

Originally Posted by Peter Hudson

Indeed the Bodkin ... Probably the least expensive and best overall performer seen here in the English box below with 8 other variants and in the bigger box European variants. Peter Hudson.

Interesting that the English variants seem to have "innies" whereas continental ones have "outies", i.e. with tangs.

[fernando]

I have actually got the wrong impression of the recurved footbow, mostly due to the size of the picture.
Some of these beasts can be very heavy (200 pounds plus) and are used primarily today for flight shooting. A sort of Olympic sport, so to say. Notwithstanding this technique is based on historical inspiration


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[Peter Hudson]

In searching for more detail on Korean Bows I discovered a stone age find of a set of arrowheads in stone... and each almost 20 centimetres long .

Seev https://www.museum.go.kr/site/eng/re...w?relicId=2043

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Peter Hudson

In searching for more detail on Korean Bows I discovered a stone age find of a set of arrowheads in stone... and each almost 20 centimetres long .

Seev https://www.museum.go.kr/site/eng/re...w?relicId=2043

That reminds me i have a few examples from American natives in my curiosities collection.
(Age certified by an archeologist).

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[Peter Hudson]

Please see https://www.google.com/search?q=fire...id:X6sr0HlSmVY

Just to re align with my original post on THE ENGLISH LONGBOW....
Regards Peter Hudson