What is a "Ganja mbatok mengkureb"?

A. G. Maisey · 19th January 2021, 04:43 AM

I've just had a look at EK, and it appears to refer to the side profile of the gonjo, where the top of the gonjo is curved, not flat.

As I said, I've never heard the term used for keris, but then, there are a lot of things in EK that are strange to me.

No idea at all what a "gonjo nungkak" is, but a "tungkakan" on a keris is the little curve down at the joint of wadidang and gonjo; "tungkak" is "heel"; "nungkak" means to follow somebody very closely, ie "on their heels".

There is a whole lexicon of keris terms that have surfaced in the last 20 or so years that I never heard used in the 1980's & 1990's. Some might have been revived from obscure old printed matter, some might have been invented. If one wishes to appear to be learned it is always a good idea to use words that nobody else knows, thus causing confusion and generating the need to ask the user exactly what he means, thereby elevating his status.

To me, this sort of thing is a part of the name game, and does not really have a whole lot to do with understanding the keris. Probably a nice thing for collectors to play with, but not really of so much use.

jagabuwana · 20th January 2021, 02:26 AM

Yeah I see your point. I can certainly think of some other fields where invented terminology doesn't help anyone to get closer to understanding the subject at hand. Corporatese, anyone?

Jean · 20th January 2021, 09:25 AM

This name is used by some sellers from Yogya (the missed Suryono for instance) but is not mentioned in the book "Keris Jawa".
It seems quite similar to the type of ganja "sebit ron tal" (see page 162 of the book "Keris Jawa").

A. G. Maisey · 20th January 2021, 10:31 AM

Yes Jean, sebit ron tal is the terminology that I'm familiar with, and in my opinion the more conventional term.

19th January 2021, 04:43 AM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,191	I've just had a look at EK, and it appears to refer to the side profile of the gonjo, where the top of the gonjo is curved, not flat. As I said, I've never heard the term used for keris, but then, there are a lot of things in EK that are strange to me. No idea at all what a "gonjo nungkak" is, but a "tungkakan" on a keris is the little curve down at the joint of wadidang and gonjo; "tungkak" is "heel"; "nungkak" means to follow somebody very closely, ie "on their heels". There is a whole lexicon of keris terms that have surfaced in the last 20 or so years that I never heard used in the 1980's & 1990's. Some might have been revived from obscure old printed matter, some might have been invented. If one wishes to appear to be learned it is always a good idea to use words that nobody else knows, thus causing confusion and generating the need to ask the user exactly what he means, thereby elevating his status. To me, this sort of thing is a part of the name game, and does not really have a whole lot to do with understanding the keris. Probably a nice thing for collectors to play with, but not really of so much use. Attached Images Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 19th January 2021 at 04:59 AM.

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20th January 2021, 02:26 AM	#2
jagabuwana Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 295	Yeah I see your point. I can certainly think of some other fields where invented terminology doesn't help anyone to get closer to understanding the subject at hand. Corporatese, anyone?

20th January 2021, 09:25 AM	#3
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	This name is used by some sellers from Yogya (the missed Suryono for instance) but is not mentioned in the book "Keris Jawa". It seems quite similar to the type of ganja "sebit ron tal" (see page 162 of the book "Keris Jawa").

20th January 2021, 10:31 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,191	Yes Jean, sebit ron tal is the terminology that I'm familiar with, and in my opinion the more conventional term.