Kattara for comments

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

Hello All,

Ibrahim, I have done some research regarding the term "Kattara كتارة" and it seems to be a term more focused on the shuhooh tribe? As you said, it seems to refer only to the curved Omani saber but the name "kattara" was also used as a person name; For example, the tribe of Ibn Kattarah (I need to research this tribe)

The term as you said, does not seem Arabic so its rather interesting!

Salaams A.alnakkas ~ I think that is interesting and the name Sayf also is a persons name. The Shihu are a very interesting tribe and their main family group is called Shehe. They give the name to a short knife that tucks in the belt and used in other closeby Omani areas (in much of Northern Oman) behind the Khanjar though technically they don't wear tha Khanjar prefering the Jers axe instead. They straddle the Oman UAE border and appear linked originally to a Persian tribe... as is the axe (Luristani linked as I see it) Today the straight Sayf flexible dancing sword is made there and in other centres like Nizwa.

I was reviewing the vast load of material already generated and looking for various links when I suddenly realised that the Long Flexible Sayf was in fact not a weapon as such but "a dancing sword."
What various dignatories visiting the region in the 1800s meant when for example they referred to ~Scotish Claymore style of weapon at Hormuz ...and in other parts of Oman ~ 2 handed weapons... capable of chopping off a limb...3 feet long swords etc is the Old Sayf often in the area of 2feet 6inches and 2 feet 8inches. The dancing sword is nearly 4 feet long. The hitting/cutting power of the old weapon is far superior as its heavy thick wing shaped and razor sharp blade would slice through much more efficiently. Then I got into a lot of conversation with old gentlemen and realised that though nothing was written down the flexible sword was simply a dancing sword. It is important all the same but now I can see where it slides into the overall plan... and why it has no European Trade Blade link at all.

The curved Kattara of course is totally different.

Thank you for your post.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Jim McDougall]

Absolutely excellent summation Ibrahiim!!! I think you have put that together spot on, and I think this is basically the best solution to the kattara/sayf conundrum thus far. Naturally other fine points will be added, but this seems to plausibly describe this grouping of sword types as contemporarily used and with varying application.
On the kattara term, though it is a reach, in the northern parts of India and Afghanistan there is a type of dagger used by Kalash tribes usually in Chitral and of course this diffused widely.....it was called a 'katara' which seems to be another term in various linguistic parlance used for daggers and swords interchangeably. Remember that in these regions particularly it is often hard to define exactly where 'sword' category ends and dagger or knife begins...the 'khyber knife' for example is a huge butcher knife the size of a sword (also termed Salawar yataghan though it has nothing to do with the traditionally specified yataghan).
Also, the term katar for the well known transverse bar daggers seems to derive from a Hindu word for 'cut'. Perhaps these terms may have entered Arab parlance via Omani presence in Baluchistan and Indian trade ?

Outstanding work here guys!!!

All the best,
Jim

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Absolutely excellent summation Ibrahiim!!! I think you have put that together spot on, and I think this is basically the best solution to the kattara/sayf conundrum thus far. Naturally other fine points will be added, but this seems to plausibly describe this grouping of sword types as contemporarily used and with varying application.
On the kattara term, though it is a reach, in the northern parts of India and Afghanistan there is a type of dagger used by Kalash tribes usually in Chitral and of course this diffused widely.....it was called a 'katara' which seems to be another term in various linguistic parlance used for daggers and swords interchangeably. Remember that in these regions particularly it is often hard to define exactly where 'sword' category ends and dagger or knife begins...the 'khyber knife' for example is a huge butcher knife the size of a sword (also termed Salawar yataghan though it has nothing to do with the traditionally specified yataghan).
Also, the term katar for the well known transverse bar daggers seems to derive from a Hindu word for 'cut'. Perhaps these terms may have entered Arab parlance via Omani presence in Baluchistan and Indian trade ?

Outstanding work here guys!!!

All the best,
Jim

Salaams Jim ~ Great reply. Great support. Thanks for your confirmation so far. I hope people can understand the vagueness that decends upon anything virtually before 1970 here... It is like entering a Mediaeval tunnel. Myth, superstition and unsubatantiated information fog the screen. I agree that we appear to be on the button with the dancing sword. I am also convinced about the Old Battle Sayf.

Regarding the curved Kattara. I agree that it could be a bastardised foreign word even from the English "cutter" or the Hindi "Katar" or qudurrah or from the Sri Lankan "kastane" or more than likely since I see a link with the Zanzibar hub and slavery off the African sword group (Kaskara?). As lofty points out there is also the possibility via a name in the Shuhooh tribe which is similar; so the book is open on that.

What I find interesting is that the Forum gave this particular tree a really good shake and eventually the facts have popped out. We even started off with the wrong terminology and corrected that in mid stream! Before this the entire world of swords was in my opinion "totally in the dark" over this important issue of the dancing sword and way out of timescale on the Old Omani Battle Sword and its important significance.
What is amazing is that the same weapon designed in or before 751 AD not only lasted up to the arrival of the dancing sword and curved Kattara but beyond that into the 20th Century though by then attaining an Iconic status (and gradually overtaken by the advent of firearms) but still the primary fighting blade of Oman for more than 1,200 years.
This BATTLESWORD weapon was a virtual heraldic symbol to the original Omani Ibathi religious style and has attained honorific Iconic proportions having been modified over the hilt in the decorative style of the Royal Khanjar for the al bu Saiid Dynasty.

The Old Omani Battlesword "Sayf" and its shield "Terrs" are classic living examples of weapon freeze.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[A.alnakkas]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Salaams A.alnakkas ~ I think that is interesting and the name Sayf also is a persons name. The Shihu are a very interesting tribe and their main family group is called Shehe. They give the name to a short knife that tucks in the belt and used in other closeby Omani areas (in much of Northern Oman) behind the Khanjar though technically they don't wear tha Khanjar prefering the Jers axe instead. They straddle the Oman UAE border and appear linked originally to a Persian tribe... as is the axe (Luristani linked as I see it) Today the straight Sayf flexible dancing sword is made there and in other centres like Nizwa.

Thank you for your post.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Hey Ibrahim,

I disagree in linking alShuhuh to a persian origin. They are arabs who have been in arabia and in the region since before Islam. It is said that they are called alShuhuh (the greedy ones or the broke ones.) because during the reign of Caliph Abu Bakr (RA) they stopped paying the zakkat along with other tribes from that region and they were fought and chased to the mountains which they still reside.

One can get an understanding of this story (whether its authentic or not) by checking the meaning of the word Shuh in a dictionary :-)

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

Hey Ibrahim,

I disagree in linking alShuhuh to a persian origin. They are arabs who have been in arabia and in the region since before Islam. It is said that they are called alShuhuh (the greedy ones or the broke ones.) because during the reign of Caliph Abu Bakr (RA) they stopped paying the zakkat along with other tribes from that region and they were fought and chased to the mountains which they still reside.

One can get an understanding of this story (whether its authentic or not) by checking the meaning of the word Shuh in a dictionary :-)

Salaams Lofty ~ Good point. Certainly they are pre Islamic and today they straddle the border of the UAE and OMAN. There is a total breakdown on the tribe somewhere and I will dig it up... There are a number of key families notably the Shehe ( I also note there are about 5 sects also underlining their sub tribal independence). They are fiercely independent even today. The small axe is very similar to the Luristani axe that it is tempting to draw a conclusion and their own linguistic form is I believe Farsi linked.

About Jerrs axes. The other almost same shaped axe appears with Bedouin in the Omani Wahiba sands region used as a camel stick and a weapon (and called a Quddum) though it is undecorated and on a shaft roughly hewn by the owner as opposed to the Mussandam style which is made by the axe maker complete. Are the two areas tribes previously linked?

Swords. So far as swords are concerned in the Shehu region they seem to have a late production of Omani Sayf only in the last 30 years or so... but that is largely heresay. I recall you indicating that the term Kattara was possibly from that area but I cannot find a link yet.

Work Knife. They also give their main family name to a small work dagger called a "shehe" and though they don't wear Khanjars up there as they favour the Jerrs axe ... they do carry this knife on a simple waistbelt whereas interestingly that knife has found its way as a work knife onto Khanjars in Northern Oman... though generally the preferred work knife is a silver worked antique English Butter Knife (Sheffield Steel ) or the German equivalent from Solingen.

I think it safer of me to describe this unusual group as probably originating from a group of Arab pre Islamic tribes possibly displaced by war, famine or other causes. The name is fascinating and further study is inviting.

On an historical note Richardson and Dorr in Volume 1 of their Craft Herritage of Oman describe the Jerrs Axe as almost identical to a bronze age axe from neighboring area tombs of Qidfa including the design patterns of herringbone, circles, dots and triangle motifs also paralleling designs on stone vessels at the site dated to the second half of the second milenium BC. Pottery also points to a link since it is proven that hand and wheel turning techniques have continued there in the Mussandam which originate in Messopotamia as early as 3000 B.C.etc.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams.. Following up the Shehe detail with Lofty I note that Bertram Thomas more or less linked the tribe with Yemen and the dialect is Kumzari which is an unwritten form. Slightly in contrast Wiki notes the similarity to Persian. I'm not certain if precise dating of the tribal blend can ever be achieved. Linguistics wise It is more likely to be geographical dialectic influence. I would however side with an Arab identity as this appears to be their main form.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams all~

Yesterday. Research took me into the Muscat Mutrah souk muddle; a sprawling mass of Omani artefacts set amongst the myriad of hundreds of stores interlinked with winding passageways in a step back in time... trade in there is seldom less than booming... and I was joined by several thousand tourists from a couple of cruise ships parked a few hundred metres away ~ See my thread on Souks of Oman.

There is only really one shop amongst hundreds of others that is worth scrutiny and I spent a few hours looking at heaps of stuff. What is obvious are the masses of Yemeni Jambiyya daggers; mostly cheap stuff. Plenty of Karabella and some half dozen Saudia swords with peculiar elongated hilts of the sort seen on thread.

I also stumbled upon a few other weapons of some note. One showed a date of 1708 followed by some undecipherable squigles. It appeared to be an Omani SAYF (dancing sword) Most peculiar ~ In a flash I could see my entire threads input lurching in a tail spin with flames accompanying !! This was indeed a puzzle and it was not until I was able to analyse the photos that it struck me by inverting the sword what it was. SOLI followed by a few squigles of which the first letter was N....An invisible finger tapped me on the shoulder at that point and whipered SOLINGEN stupid !

The blade not of the same material as a normal Omani Sayf ... The long hilt having been put on by the shop owner 10 years ago and he couldnt remember if it was a welded on Tang !! By pure chance the sword owner walked in... and by even purer chance I knew the lady from 15 years ago ~ A visitor to my shop here !! The sword had come back in for a clean up ///
No one had any idea what this was. Now I realise what it is

On the reverse is a strange set of capital letters that seem to read STAMM STAMM repeated twice on the blade commencing at the hilt though the first few letters of the first word are a bit unreadable. I assume it is STAMM. The meaning is unknown. The letters are identical in style with flared ends.

Before anyone faints I have to caution that this is the only one I have ever seen and that the hilt is probably modified on a Solingen blade of early manufacture since the style of alphabet is the old one with small flares at the end of each capital letter. The date is unknown. I would say 17th or 18th C. It may be a blade off the African side... not as broad as Omani sayf, culminating in a point and flexible but not so flexible as an Omani Sayf. One fuller.We are lucky in that I have identified the man who reworked the hilt and the owner who lives in Muscat... Lucky indeed.

So that forum can take a swing at this I have isolated this on one post and will present the other finds separately... it gets interesting..

PHOTOS
The sword being discussed in this post is at the top of the first picture. The other two swords and others will be discussed in another post.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams all, Omani Battle Sword; Sayf.

SECOND SWORD

Odd for a few reasons...
1. Three Fullers.
2. Top rivvet hole filled whereas normally its empty and considered as the wrist strap hole. Filled, however, it cetainly gives a better supported hilt.
3. Squigles on the blade at the throat on one side only. If its letters I cannot decipher. Perhaps this is a running wolf insignia.

Right next door to Mutrah Souk is a fine example of an old archway similar to the design of the Hilt on Omani Battle Sword; Sayf. Pictured below.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams all ~ This is where the wheel comes off the bike slightly !
THIRD SWORD.

Old Omani Battle Sword; Sayf.(half hilt missing) This sword raises a few questions viz;


1. European PDKG and asterisks ~An unknown Insignia on this blade.
2. Thin and narrow blade.

I would caution that this thinness and narrow aspect of blade is perhaps the only one like this I have seen. I have never before seen this insignia . It may be the missing link ie the so called 17th century european blade for the Old Omani Battle Sword. Note also that the capital letters appear as quite old gothic in style with flared ends as in the first sword at top of picture and in earlier post ( gothic revival ?) :cool
On research I note a few leads pointing to possible answers from Sotheby's -
1.A small-sword, late 18th century, with hollow-triangular blade etched and gilt with ... circa 1650, with slender double-edged blade, stamped 'Sahagon' within the ... cut with running wolf mark, the spurious date 1616, and the letters 'PDKG' on ...

2.An Indian sword (pata), 18th century, the letters 'PDKG' on ...etc etc

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Iain]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Salaams all, Omani Battle Sword; Sayf.

SECOND SWORD

Odd for a few reasons...
1. Three Fullers.
2. Top rivvet hole filled whereas normally its empty and considered as the wrist strap hole. Filled, however, it cetainly gives a better supported hilt.
3. Squigles on the blade at the throat on one side only. If its letters I cannot decipher. Perhaps this is a running wolf insignia.

Right next door to Mutrah Souk is a fine example of an old archway similar to the design of the Hilt on Omani Battle Sword; Sayf. Pictured below.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Fascinating example, unusual to see this form with fullers. The mark seems to be script to me rather than a running wolf or similar. I think this has quite some age to it.

A piece I would love to own.