Spirit Cage [revisited]

Bill M · 8th January 2019, 02:39 PM

I had posted this earlier and tried to delete that post. However the keris keeps coming back in my mind and I am reposting. Please excuse my redundancy.

Not sure what this is. It was called a "Spirit Cage" A tombak is in the center. Keris is shown to show size. It has traces of kineta.

I am very curious about this. It does have a "presence" a sense of some kind of strange power. Not good, nor bad, just powerful.

I think it is called a bethok krawangan keris, with a fixed menur tombak inside. It does not rattle. My description may be incorrect and would appreciate your opinions.

The handle and scabbard is rough.

If there is interest, I will try to get better detail images, possibly lighting from the other side to see the tombak better.

kai · 10th January 2019, 11:34 PM

Hello Bill,

This has me dumbfounded and others as well, I guess. While it may not be my cup of tea, the displayed skill and patience is certainly impressive.

I assume the tombak inside does not carry a methuk but rather the methuk/mendak on the outside is used to tightly fix the ensemble, isn't it?

Did you got any provenance or other info with it?

Regards,
Kai

David · 11th January 2019, 04:35 AM

Bill, my feeling about this is that it is just lovely, but i can't figure our whether this piece serves a deeper spiritual function worthy of the name "spirit cage" or if it's just beautiful for beauty's sake. Either way is a justifiable reason for being.

Addendum: I don't get the feeling it is particularly old though. Which makes me wonder about the worn away kinatah look. That can be a popular dealer technique to make a newer keris look old. Or maybe it's just a way to save on gold coasts.

Either way it does make me wonder what a creation like this would look like in full stain and completely in kinatah as seems to be the original intention of the design.

kai · 11th January 2019, 08:30 AM

Hello Bill,

I'm with David - very likely originates from Karmadikan times.

It certainly focuses on the artistic side of things with the whole gandik as well as the gonjo hollowed out which is quite a feat to achieve!

Can you tell if the tombak inside was made to fit or whether it is an older blade?

Regards,
Kai

Bill M · 11th January 2019, 05:26 PM

Not sure where or from whom I got it, but they called it a Spirit Cage. Does seem well-done and has a strange 'presence.'

A "Indonesian" friend has one similar and he calls it "betok" thinks it came from Bali. Now lives in Amsterdam.

I have permission to show the blade, but no permission to show faces and blanked them out

Rick · 11th January 2019, 06:28 PM

It looks huge!

Your's is a much smaller example, Bill, yes?

kai · 11th January 2019, 06:57 PM

Hello Bill,

Does it also have a tombak inside?

And what seems to poke through the gandik?

Regards,
Kai

Bill M · 12th January 2019, 12:32 AM

I don't know more about the other "bethok." He is sending me more pictures and a write up.

8th January 2019, 02:39 PM	#1
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	Spirit Cage [revisited] I had posted this earlier and tried to delete that post. However the keris keeps coming back in my mind and I am reposting. Please excuse my redundancy. Not sure what this is. It was called a "Spirit Cage" A tombak is in the center. Keris is shown to show size. It has traces of kineta. I am very curious about this. It does have a "presence" a sense of some kind of strange power. Not good, nor bad, just powerful. I think it is called a bethok krawangan keris, with a fixed menur tombak inside. It does not rattle. My description may be incorrect and would appreciate your opinions. The handle and scabbard is rough. If there is interest, I will try to get better detail images, possibly lighting from the other side to see the tombak better. Attached Images

11th January 2019, 05:26 PM	#5
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	Not sure where or from whom I got it, but they called it a Spirit Cage. Does seem well-done and has a strange 'presence.' A "Indonesian" friend has one similar and he calls it "betok" thinks it came from Bali. Now lives in Amsterdam. I have permission to show the blade, but no permission to show faces and blanked them out Attached Images Last edited by Bill M; 11th January 2019 at 05:45 PM.

10th January 2019, 11:34 PM	#2
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Hello Bill, This has me dumbfounded and others as well, I guess. While it may not be my cup of tea, the displayed skill and patience is certainly impressive. I assume the tombak inside does not carry a methuk but rather the methuk/mendak on the outside is used to tightly fix the ensemble, isn't it? Did you got any provenance or other info with it? Regards, Kai

11th January 2019, 04:35 AM	#3
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,250	Bill, my feeling about this is that it is just lovely, but i can't figure our whether this piece serves a deeper spiritual function worthy of the name "spirit cage" or if it's just beautiful for beauty's sake. Either way is a justifiable reason for being. Addendum: I don't get the feeling it is particularly old though. Which makes me wonder about the worn away kinatah look. That can be a popular dealer technique to make a newer keris look old. Or maybe it's just a way to save on gold coasts. Either way it does make me wonder what a creation like this would look like in full stain and completely in kinatah as seems to be the original intention of the design.

11th January 2019, 08:30 AM	#4
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Hello Bill, I'm with David - very likely originates from Karmadikan times. It certainly focuses on the artistic side of things with the whole gandik as well as the gonjo hollowed out which is quite a feat to achieve! Can you tell if the tombak inside was made to fit or whether it is an older blade? Regards, Kai

11th January 2019, 06:28 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,376	It looks huge! Your's is a much smaller example, Bill, yes?

11th January 2019, 06:57 PM	#7
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Hello Bill, Does it also have a tombak inside? And what seems to poke through the gandik? Regards, Kai

12th January 2019, 12:32 AM	#8
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	I don't know more about the other "bethok." He is sending me more pictures and a write up.