Ottoman Hancer for translation please

[mariusgmioc]

Can somebody help me with the translation of the koftgari on this hancer?

[Battara]

Under the Ottomans it is from Albania. Very nice.

[serdar]

Is it yours?
It was on herman historica auction.
It is ottoman dagger, but it has nothing to do with albania, lots of people call this type of dagger albanian but it isnt.
It has walrus ivory hilt, albanians never used walrus nor this type of hilt or silverwork, nor it is from balkans.

[serdar]

About translation Alah is visible but rest not so.
Probably in the name of god, or similar phrase.

[Battara]

If this is not Albanian, then where do you say it is from?

[serdar]

I realy dont know why people call this kind of a dagger albanian, i saw it called like that on several sites, but then again people all over internet call 18/19 century jannisery kilij a pala and pala is a diferent kind of a sword.

In albania weapons made in their workshops were a lower quality, so they mainly used those and for higher end pieces, import from bosnia, boka kotorska or greece, and neither in albania nor neighbours workshops did they made these daggers.

Where is it from? I realy dont know, from some part of ottoman empire, maybe few examples in the past ended up in balkan area with invading ottomans, but i never saw one neither in museum, nor in annyone collection.

For example zeybek yatagans, they came with invading ottoman armies, so there are few examples in museums in montenegro.

There is also sirian dagger in silver, that people in many cases name albanian, but it has nothing to do with albania.

Lots of daggers and swords from boka kotorska with marvelous silverwork were proclaimed persian, although they got nothing to do with persia.

It originated from some were but from where, who would know.

[gp]

Serdar is correct; not at all Balkan or former Yu area, not even to speak of Albania....

many sellers do make this mistake and others just take this over like this wrong example:
https://oriental-arms.com/home/906-o...ar-dagger.html


the style comes closer to Persian type khanjar / handzar / hancar, like in these examples:

https://www.mandarinmansion.com/glossary/khanjar
https://www.arms-armor-arts.com/en/c...rsian-khanjar/
https://www.arms-armor-arts.com/en/c...toman-khanjar/
https://www.spesbona-arms.com/produc...ttoman-khanjar
https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/31853

[Battara]

Interesting information, thank you.

In these examples, I do not see one with the same hilt form as this one.

[gp]

I understand what you are saying but the hilt type is not Balkan or European Ottoman. Also the blade type and decoration hardly.
That is more to be found in the Persian hemispheres during the Ottoman time.

Indeed the bottom and top of the hilt is quite different compared to my examples....but it is not often to be seen .
This dagger appears through the last 2 decades on auction sites and everybody refers to the "Albanian" roots but no one ever explained why or provided proof.
Neither disrespect nor offence intended to auctioneers, but when it comes to Balkan Ottoman cold weapons, I have seen very "interesting" country allocations...
Hence my thought ( and I could be mistaken nevertheless...) that "Albanian" is more an assumption than a real defined one or a detailed analysis added.

If it would be Albanian it would have been found more often in the Balkan museums, literature, etc... as well
Hence my links as references of my thoughts.
There are also quite some pictures of Balkan kamas, handzjars and bichaqs in this forum to compare as well

Closest from blade, decoration and hilt ( excluding the specific top and bottom) is more Persian. But as said, I could be wrong but would like to see proof.