Madura Keris?

[Pendita65]

Hi all,

After lurking for the last six months I picked up this 9 luk Keris yesterday. It's I need of some serious TLC. It sure can use a good cleaning of the rust. I don't know a lot about it what I find interesting is that the wilah is standing in an angle from the Hilt. The Warangka is a model i have seen before but don't know how it is called. And my guess is that the Keris is from Madura. There is pamor to be seen but after derusting it might be better visible.

Hope someone can provide me some more info about this Keris.

Thnx for now and regards

Martin

[Sajen]

Hi Martin,

Jep, the sarung is Madurese. But like you I can't name it exactly.
Pics of my example attached.

Regards,
Detlef

[Sajen]

All three I've have/had (one I sold) and one from Alan G. Maisey.

[A. G. Maisey]

Yes, Madura, dress is a sandang walikat style.

It is possible that in Madura, sandang walikat might be known by a different name, but if it is, I do not know that name.

[Pendita65]

Thank you both so much, for the information. and i was also wondering the hilt /hulu when you hold it straight up the wilah is really under an angle, that is different than most of the keris i have.

Maybe a stupid question but has it a name? And if i am right it has 9 luk?

Regards, Martin

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Pendita65

And if i am right it has 9 luk?

Jep, I count 9 luk.

[A. G. Maisey]

Did you mean a dhapur name?

The dhapur names that are generally known come from a pakem, or guide-book that was produced as a reference to dhapurs as they were known in Surakarta.

It is really only accurate for Surakarta, but we do tend to use those names for all of Jawa.

This keris is from Madura, & it possibly has --- or had --- a unique Madura name, which might still be known by some people in Madura, but which I do not know.

Then we have another problem with the eroded condition of this keris. Determination of a dhapur depends upon the presence or absence of specific characteristics, & this keris is so badly eroded that we cannot be sure exactly what characteristics were present when it was new.

However, we are all free to name a keris which is in our care with its own name.

[Pendita65]

Thank you Mr. Maisey and Detlef,

yes i was curious what the dhapur would be, but most of the time the wilah is more in line with the hulu or ukiran. and this keris the wilah goes with a bevel arround 50 degrees.

So i was curious if this has a name in determinating a Keris.


Regards, Martin

[A. G. Maisey]

This is actually a pretty good question Martin --- I think of "good questions" as ones that I need to think about before I can respond to, and although I could have given a quick, off-the-cuff response to this question, I've been thinking about how best I should respond. I think I might now be able to do so.

In Jawa, when we refer to the angle of a keris blade, we refer to that as the "condong campur" of the blade.

"condong campur" applied to the keris & in Bahasa Indonesia can be understood as a "confused angle", actual translation is campur = mixed/confused, condong = leaning; used in Basa Jawa context the understanding is similar but the actual translation is campur = to mix, condhong = in agreement with.

So the blade angle in this keris is bit too "condong campur".

Now, in the Surakarta Pakem, there is a straight keris that is Dhapur Condhong Campur. It has not been drawn with an extreme blade angle, the only remarkable thing about it is that it has sogokan for the full length of the blade. There is also a waved keris that is given as Condhong Campur.

So there you have an explanation of how we would think of this keris in Jawa, but it still does not give you a dhapur name for it, and in my opinion, the blade is far too worn for us to be able to determine exactly how it looked when new.

Footnote: in fact the practical application of this extreme angle is an attempt at an ergonomic application, the angle moves the blade point to a position more favourable to centering on an opponent's body. Now that doesn't matter much today, but it might have provided some slight advantage when keris were used to end life.

[Pendita65]

Dear Mr. Maisey,

thank you again for the way you took the time to think about my question and giving an good explanation. Step by step i learn new things about the Keris and it is an never ending story i guess in getting into the depth of the keris and its meanings in execution and the mystical side of it.

I just aquired the book by David Gallas about the mystical side of the Keris.
called: Pusaka Pangruwating Jiwa.
So hope to gain more insight into the world of Keris.

Have a nice day and thank you so much again,

Regards, Martin

[A. G. Maisey]

You're most welcome Martin.