Bag/Belt Axe or Old Roofing Tool?

mgolab · 25th July 2023, 04:09 PM

Hello Again:

This is the other axe in my collection that I would appreciate any comments/ feedback on. Pretty sure this one is hand forged and handle looks quite old. Based on my research, this one looks more akin to a traditional frontier belt/bag axe.

Dimensions:

5 inches from blade to poll

3inches blade width

10inches overall

15.6 oz

David · 25th July 2023, 09:40 PM

Seems more a tool than a weapon.

AHite · 26th July 2023, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Seems more a tool than a weapon.

Hatchets and their predecessors tomahawks are vicious weapons. The infamous Lizzy Borden supposedly used a hatchet to murder her parents. But yes, this is a tool not made with the intent to be a weapon.

M ELEY · 26th July 2023, 05:42 AM

Now on this one, I will pause and say in my opinion, this seems like the real deal. Again, there will always be different opinions on these because by their very nature, they are controversial. Hammer pole axes preceded the traditional tool axe, so the only thing that defines one as a weapon and one as as tool are very subtle differences and the time period they were used. Likewise, remember that the pole axe was meant BOTH as a tool and a weapon. The hammer end acted as a counter balance to give a more massive blow, but it could equally be used to chop wood, skin game or hammer in a tent peg. This one appears old, is obviously hand-made and is of an earlier double bearded form. If we accept this as a true hammer pole and not a tool hammer axe, its dimensions indicate that it is indeed a so-called 'bag axe', a more diminutive form compared to a rifleman's belt axe. This is just my opinion, so you can take it for what its worth-

fernando · 26th July 2023, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Seems more a tool than a weapon.

Definitely.

mgolab · 26th July 2023, 12:42 PM

Thanks M ELEY for the detailed analysis.

What are your thoughts as to approximate age? My thought was late 18th century to early 19th century. Say 1770s to 1830s...

M ELEY · 26th July 2023, 08:42 PM

I think your dating is pretty spot-on, long before the days of 'hardware store' pieces. These tools hung around and were essential for survival. I think it's a great little axe!

gp · 26th July 2023, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Seems more a tool than a weapon.

most Asian weapons are actually tools...

at least the ones from martial arts
a poor man's defensive piece against superior attackers

Interested Party · 27th July 2023, 08:43 PM

I find the slightly offset eye interesting and tool like. Useful to a right-handed person for smoothing and shaping poles and small beams.

fernando · 28th July 2023, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Interested Party

... I find the slightly offset eye interesting and tool like. Useful to a right-handed person for smoothing and shaping poles and small beams...

Sharp eye !

David · 30th July 2023, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gp

most Asian weapons are actually tools...

at least the ones from martial arts
a poor man's defensive piece against superior attackers

No argument there. But just about ANYTHING can be used as a weapon with enough ingenuity. I could kill someone with a hammer, a pair of scissors or a screwdriver as well. But we generally discuss intentional weapons on this page and tools end up in the Miscellaneous Forum.

fernando · 30th July 2023, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

No argument there. But just about ANYTHING can be used as a weapon with enough ingenuity. I could kill someone with a hammer, a pair of scissors or a screwdriver as well. But we generally discuss intentional weapons on this page and tools end up in the Miscellaneous Forum.

And off we go

.

A. G. Maisey · 30th July 2023, 11:48 PM

Like a pen.

Very highly under rated implement.

kronckew · 7th August 2023, 10:31 AM

Tool. And rather crudely made. The 'side axe' offset is good for woodwork, but makes it a terrible weapon.

David R · 2nd December 2023, 12:18 AM

A nice piece with some serious age to it, hand forged with wrap around construction. I would call it a camp axe or bag axe.

Richard G · 3rd December 2023, 06:43 PM

It could be a butcher's\slaughterman's axe. These often had a poll that was designed to be struck by a mallet thus enabling the blade to be placed accurately. Rather like a woodsplitting axe.
I'm not saying it is - just, could be.
Best wishes
Richard

C4RL · 6th December 2023, 09:23 PM

I would say it's a blacksmith made carpenter's / roofers hatchet with what might be a newer "adze eye" (square) style handle made to fit. Not easy to tell from the photos.

Richard G · 11th January 2024, 03:51 PM

I came across this the other day. Shows what can be done with a sharp lathing axe.
Sorry about the music.

Regards
Richard

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/4uarkKxJkZs

25th July 2023, 04:09 PM	#1
mgolab Member Join Date: Jun 2023 Posts: 118	Bag/Belt Axe or Old Roofing Tool? Hello Again: This is the other axe in my collection that I would appreciate any comments/ feedback on. Pretty sure this one is hand forged and handle looks quite old. Based on my research, this one looks more akin to a traditional frontier belt/bag axe. Dimensions: 5 inches from blade to poll 3inches blade width 10inches overall 15.6 oz Attached Images

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25th July 2023, 09:40 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,250	Seems more a tool than a weapon.

26th July 2023, 05:42 AM	#4
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,206	Now on this one, I will pause and say in my opinion, this seems like the real deal. Again, there will always be different opinions on these because by their very nature, they are controversial. Hammer pole axes preceded the traditional tool axe, so the only thing that defines one as a weapon and one as as tool are very subtle differences and the time period they were used. Likewise, remember that the pole axe was meant BOTH as a tool and a weapon. The hammer end acted as a counter balance to give a more massive blow, but it could equally be used to chop wood, skin game or hammer in a tent peg. This one appears old, is obviously hand-made and is of an earlier double bearded form. If we accept this as a true hammer pole and not a tool hammer axe, its dimensions indicate that it is indeed a so-called 'bag axe', a more diminutive form compared to a rifleman's belt axe. This is just my opinion, so you can take it for what its worth-

26th July 2023, 12:42 PM	#6
mgolab Member Join Date: Jun 2023 Posts: 118	Thanks M ELEY for the detailed analysis. What are your thoughts as to approximate age? My thought was late 18th century to early 19th century. Say 1770s to 1830s...

26th July 2023, 08:42 PM	#7
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,206	I think your dating is pretty spot-on, long before the days of 'hardware store' pieces. These tools hung around and were essential for survival. I think it's a great little axe!

27th July 2023, 08:43 PM	#9
Interested Party Member Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Eastern Sierra Posts: 511	I find the slightly offset eye interesting and tool like. Useful to a right-handed person for smoothing and shaping poles and small beams.

30th July 2023, 11:48 PM	#13
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,085	Like a pen. Very highly under rated implement.

7th August 2023, 10:31 AM	#14
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,259	Tool. And rather crudely made. The 'side axe' offset is good for woodwork, but makes it a terrible weapon.

2nd December 2023, 12:18 AM	#15
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,135	A nice piece with some serious age to it, hand forged with wrap around construction. I would call it a camp axe or bag axe.

3rd December 2023, 06:43 PM	#16
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 415	It could be a butcher's\slaughterman's axe. These often had a poll that was designed to be struck by a mallet thus enabling the blade to be placed accurately. Rather like a woodsplitting axe. I'm not saying it is - just, could be. Best wishes Richard

6th December 2023, 09:23 PM	#17
C4RL Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 50	I would say it's a blacksmith made carpenter's / roofers hatchet with what might be a newer "adze eye" (square) style handle made to fit. Not easy to tell from the photos.

11th January 2024, 03:51 PM	#18
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 415	I came across this the other day. Shows what can be done with a sharp lathing axe. Sorry about the music. Regards Richard https://www.youtube.com/shorts/4uarkKxJkZs