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21st October 2013, 06:52 PM
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#1 |
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 462
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iron spear indian ?
It measures 45 cm long,
I think what would be Indian can you give me your opinion |
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21st October 2013, 06:54 PM
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#2 |
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 462
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Once cleaned
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22nd October 2013, 12:01 AM
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#3 |
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Warwickshire, England
Posts: 150
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An interesting item, and well made, but I don't think Indian, I think African. A wild guess would be Congo - but I'm sure there are others who could be more exact.
I can see why you would say Indian though! Regards, Runjeet |
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22nd October 2013, 06:44 AM
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#4 |
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(deceased)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: OKLAHOMA, USA
Posts: 3,138
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THE DESIGN ON THE BLADE STRIKES ME AS AFRICAN ALSO PERHAPS A PROCESSIONAL SPEAR HEAD FOR A STANDARD BEARING POLE. THE WORKMANSHIP IS DIFFERENT THAN I USUALLY ASSOCIATE WITH CONGO SO MAYBE ETHIOPIA OR HAUSA TRIBE FROM NIGERIA OR MOORISH. JUST MY BEST GUESSES I AM SURE THOSE MEMBERS MORE KNOWLEGABLE IN THE FIELD WILL BE ABLE TO GIVE BETTER INFORMATION. WHATEVER IT IS ITS VERY WELL MADE AND I LIKE IT.
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22nd October 2013, 07:09 AM
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#5 | |
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 462
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Quote:
It is the job of the socket which makes me say this, I've never seen African spear with a socket if worked and rencorced, I attached a picture with some Indian Sockets photos..I'm wrong can be! |
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22nd October 2013, 09:46 AM
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#6 |
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Belgium
Posts: 132
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Never seen such type from Congo.
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22nd October 2013, 09:54 AM
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#7 |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Wirral
Posts: 1,204
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The blade decoration certainly looks more African than Indian.
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22nd October 2013, 11:54 AM
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#8 |
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,429
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I vote for Sierra Leone - 19th century.
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22nd October 2013, 01:13 PM
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#9 |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Wirral
Posts: 1,204
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Here are some pics of a spearhead with similar characteristics to the central head in question ..... not very clear but note similar blade decoration . I have always taken this spear head to be African , though do not not which region.
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24th October 2013, 02:33 PM
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#10 |
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Posts: 415
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24th October 2013, 02:38 PM
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#11 | |
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 1,719
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Quote:
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25th October 2013, 10:28 AM
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#12 |
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,429
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From W O Oldman "Illustrated Catalogue of Ethnographical Specimens" 1907 - listed as "Mendiland, used by Chief Lobo"
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25th October 2013, 02:39 PM
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#13 | |
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 462
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Quote:
so it is sierra leone |
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25th October 2013, 06:31 PM
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#14 | |
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 1,719
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Quote:
I'm always amazed on the forum how someone seems to recognize almost anything! |
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25th October 2013, 07:10 PM
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#15 | |
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Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,670
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Quote:
Totally agree Iain!!! It is fascinating to see how closely paralleled Indian and African arms can often be, and we well know a good number of these such as the haladie used in Sudan, deriving from Rajasthan origins and via Syria to N. Africa. My first inclination on this spearhead would have been S. India due to the spaced collars on it, but in seeing the geometric linear decoration would have gone directly to Africa. That particular Oldman reference, one precursor to Stones venerable work, has of course its own flaws in degree, despite being overall quite reliable. I recall one item shown as a Tibetan short sword used as a reference to one same I acquired many years ago, and claimed from the British expedition there c. 1903? I later discovered it was in fact a Dahomean hwi and an identical example documented and provenanced in a Belgian museum from c. 1850. |
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27th October 2013, 05:40 PM
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#16 |
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,429
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These spears seem a bit atypical for African weapons, in fact they remind me more of European polearms, such as the "Langue de Boeuf"...
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27th October 2013, 06:16 PM
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#17 | |
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 1,719
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Quote:
Similar perhaps to the complex hilt swords seen in coastal Congo from the same influences. |
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28th October 2013, 01:24 PM
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#18 | |
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,429
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Quote:
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28th October 2013, 07:30 PM
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#19 |
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 440
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Very nice spear! I have no idea where it may be from. However, an interesting and perhaps diagnostic feature is that the smaller outer blades appear to be a separate piece that slides over the central blade. This was probably done when red hot and the hole contracted and held it in place on the central blade as it cooled. Is that unique or a feature of other spears? None of the other examples shown seem to share it.
Just a thought, Ed |
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