I too have been following this thread with great interest. I believe this is one of the most interesting threads we have had here in some time, at least to me. Unfortunately the debate seems to be descending into a general "prickliness" which i feel at this point must be addressed. This is, for me at least, very important information to understand about the keris. I must, however, demand that the conversation remains civil. Please don't misunderstand, so far it pretty much has, but i would like both of you gentlemen to consider how you phrase your thoughts and believes carefully so that we can indeed keep this conversation friendly and on track. Thank you!