Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Do Phallic shaped Ukirans have any traditional background?

A. G. Maisey · 24th July 2023, 02:08 PM

This overt phallic representation would not be tolerated in any Islamic society, yet here in post #7 we see a hilt form that is suited only to a keris that would come from an Islamic society.

Is this a genuine keris hilt intended for use & wear on a keris that would be worn in an Islamic society?

I believe we all know the answer to that question.

I have seen many hilts and and carvings that have the overall appearance of keris hilts, but could never be worn on any keris in Bali.

I first encountered this type of carving during the 1970's, and it still exists today. It used to come from Lombok and was quite often seen in the tourist markets of South Bali. The carving of this type that I have seen in recent years appears to be coming from Madura. It is also possible some might now be carved in Bali, but I doubt it --- much of the tourist targeted carving sold in Bali is actually produced in Jawa, mostly in Central Jawa & in the areas around Surabaya. It is produced in areas other than Bali because the wage rates in Central Jawa and other deprived regions are far below what they are in Bali.

In my experience this openly sexual type of thing is only ever purchased by visitors to Bali, I have not yet seen this sort of thing offered for sale in Jawa.

I have seen these carvings attached to older keris that have been on offer to tourists, I have never seen any Balinese person wearing a keris with an overtly phallic hilt, & I simply cannot imagine how or where any Balinese person could wear a keris dressed in this fashion, or if any sane Balinese man might want to wear such a keris.

I have not yet seen a genuinely old example of an overtly phallic keris hilt, either Balinese or any other.

I my opinion this type of carving originated in Lombok and was produced only for the tourist market. There are many items produced for the tourist market in Bali that use precisely the same phallic form, items such as bottle openers, kitchen spoons, letter openers, keyrings & etc & etc & etc.

Having said all of that, I will now add this:- a very famous, very highly respected connoisseur of Indonesian art, who also had rather deviant sexual proclivities was famous not only for his interest in art & especially keris, but also for his impressive collection of keris related items that were extremely sexually orientated. He favoured phallic & yonic keris display stands and statues, yonic wrongkos, phallic hilts. He even had an armchair that was carved in yonic form.

However, that collection was kept under cover and nobody but the trusted few ever got to see it.

24th July 2023, 02:08 PM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,748	This overt phallic representation would not be tolerated in any Islamic society, yet here in post #7 we see a hilt form that is suited only to a keris that would come from an Islamic society. Is this a genuine keris hilt intended for use & wear on a keris that would be worn in an Islamic society? I believe we all know the answer to that question. I have seen many hilts and and carvings that have the overall appearance of keris hilts, but could never be worn on any keris in Bali. I first encountered this type of carving during the 1970's, and it still exists today. It used to come from Lombok and was quite often seen in the tourist markets of South Bali. The carving of this type that I have seen in recent years appears to be coming from Madura. It is also possible some might now be carved in Bali, but I doubt it --- much of the tourist targeted carving sold in Bali is actually produced in Jawa, mostly in Central Jawa & in the areas around Surabaya. It is produced in areas other than Bali because the wage rates in Central Jawa and other deprived regions are far below what they are in Bali. In my experience this openly sexual type of thing is only ever purchased by visitors to Bali, I have not yet seen this sort of thing offered for sale in Jawa. I have seen these carvings attached to older keris that have been on offer to tourists, I have never seen any Balinese person wearing a keris with an overtly phallic hilt, & I simply cannot imagine how or where any Balinese person could wear a keris dressed in this fashion, or if any sane Balinese man might want to wear such a keris. I have not yet seen a genuinely old example of an overtly phallic keris hilt, either Balinese or any other. I my opinion this type of carving originated in Lombok and was produced only for the tourist market. There are many items produced for the tourist market in Bali that use precisely the same phallic form, items such as bottle openers, kitchen spoons, letter openers, keyrings & etc & etc & etc. Having said all of that, I will now add this:- a very famous, very highly respected connoisseur of Indonesian art, who also had rather deviant sexual proclivities was famous not only for his interest in art & especially keris, but also for his impressive collection of keris related items that were extremely sexually orientated. He favoured phallic & yonic keris display stands and statues, yonic wrongkos, phallic hilts. He even had an armchair that was carved in yonic form. However, that collection was kept under cover and nobody but the trusted few ever got to see it.