I'm 58, and been collecting stuff since I was about 7 or so.

First purchase was an awful Syrian dagger, from a school friend, for 2 shillings and sixpence.
First bayonet was a 1907 pattern Wilkinson, looking brand new, for one pound.
Tulwars at the time cost three pounds each, or two for five quid....with silver or gold koftgari.
We thought they must be chat, and didn't buy any. Besides, we didn't have a fiver!
First muzzle-loading gun was a cut down flint fowler, converted to percussion, with broken stock
Fixed it up and used it a long time. It was magic!...and cost nine pounds.
Swords came a bit later,(In the last 10 years) with the added benefit (?) of a chance to sparr.

I do think this is the same as sports cars;
By the time you can afford them, you are too old to drive them!...

Richard.

56

Started when I was 18 after years of admiring a saw-backed K98 bayonet that belonged to my Grandfather. I still have it now. Collected bayonets for a few years then went to work in Sabah in 1982 and got interested in S.E Asian weapons. There were lots about in the UK in those days. Like most collectors I can still remember the things I should have bought while they were available. Oh well, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Roy

32 now and collecting since the last 8 years or so....!!!!!

25 since July and a history geek since I can remember. First weapon I ever acquired was some tiny little dagger, supposedly Indian, which my grandfather acquired god-knows-where or when, and by which I was fascinated inordinately. Jezails became my thing after I heard about them from my dad (also a history buff to an extent), and we acquired one at work (which is documented here). Unfortunately, due to Britain's obsession with gun control, getting a crack at shooting any isn't looking likely for some while.

Hopefully I'll still be doing this when I turn 70-odd and can barely remember which end of the piece does what :D

No private gun ranges where you can shoot unlicensed? I'm surprised black powder is heavily regulated.

In any case good to see there's a few of us under "middle age" here. :D

This is a fantastic thread Gene! It is a great opportunity for us all to get to know each other a little better, understand more on our interests, which is wonderful perspective.
Actually its not an 'old mans' hobby, but a lifelong passion! It seems most of us 'old timers' are simply still pursuing what overtook our very being in much younger years.
I am 67, and have loved history and intriguing mysteries from my earliest memories. My dad was a bomber pilot in WWII, mom an army nurse, and he remained flying so we were always around military bases. The war was still a recent memory and materials were everywhere and my first interests were in medals, patches etc. Then I saw bayonets in surplus stores, and began reading about swords in dictionaries and encyclopedias and noticing how many kinds there were! It was the beginning of an obsession that has only progressed.
My first actual sword was actually an old Moro keris which was in a guys garage, and I won by helping him sand down an old Model A frame. The rest is as we say 'history' :)
While I truly enjoyed collecting, despite limited means, I discovered that far more important to me were books, so I could learn more about the swords.
I began the assembling of what became an ever growing library, and an ever widening scope of interests in the history of historical arms.

These days the book lined den and modest groupings of worn swords are memories, and given way to a nomadic lifestyle in the RV we affectionately call the Bookmobile (for the key volumes stashed in every nook and cranny). ...and my passion for the study of arms is focused mostly in the years of writing on these pages. Naturally as most here know very well, I am seldom ever brief on anything.....so this follows suit :)

It is great to know more on you guys, and best of all to share in this wonderful passion of ours with all of you. You guys are the best!!!
Thank you so much !!!

All the best,
Jim

It's surprisingly heavily regulated, since it's legally classed as an explosive. (Modern smokeless stuff, by contrast, is not - I have not a clue why.) See here for some information. The amusing bit is that I can waltz into any old shop and buy fireworks with a reasonable quantity of BP in them over the counter, no questions asked.

You also need a good reason to have it - for shooting powders, you'd therefore need a shotgun (Section II) license, if you were using a smoothbore gun, or a Firearms (Section I) license if using a rifled musket. Shotgun certs are easier to get but you still have to jump through hoops.

Far as I know there hasn't been such a thing as an "unregulated", legal, operating firearm of any kind here since 1968.

Great stuff Jim but the fear is that in the west not many young men take up collecting this sort of stuff knowadays... Not like when when we were young men , then many boys/men were interested in guns & swords.

Spiral

Hi,
DO NOT under any circumstances shoot an antique weapon without first having it looked at by a competent gunsmith. I believe Rick (rickystl) shoots antiques but as far as I know he has the barrel relined before firing them. If you want to have a go at muzzleloaders join a local gun club with a muzzleloading section. Blackpowder is classed as an explosive in the U.K. and is subject to different storage regulations to smokeless powders and a license specifically for blackpowder is required. Always safety first.
Regards,
Norman.

Black powder is a simple but very effiecent, off low explosive, Smokeless generaly is not, it burns in a more more even progresive manner, I understand.

As for fireworks.....Its the old habitual stuff I guess, rather like if tobbaco was discovered today it would be illegal.

Spiral

Indeed when tobbaco appeared in Europe, in all its pure strength, the effects were so frightening that, in some nations, even death penalty was established ... i think in France.
... Just a curiosity note :cool:

It's an option, Jonathan ... but also a different approach :o .
I wouldn't let my children play with toy weapons; but my (only) daughter enjoys my pleasure for antique ( i mean antique) weapons :cool: .

Norm, when it comes to kit I agree with safety first, believe me. I've no issue with the Proofing laws in this country, which I think entirely sensible and, indeed, in one's ownj interest and those of the gun trade as a whole. Firing an unchecked barrel is always going to be a risky business, and, while I resent the implication that I'm too bloody stupid to grasp that idea, I understand that it's simply too big a minefield to leave people to get guns checked competently of their own volition.

My disagreement lies with the (IMO) too-restrictive firearms ownership regulations in Britain, which is a whole different kettle of fish, not for this forum.

Regarding clubs, my nearest muzzle-loading club is in Wakefield, about 30-40 miles (or an hour's travel time) away. I did look at going there, but since I'd need to obtain a gun of my own to shoot there anyway, it hardly seemed worth the effort - especially since I'd need the attendant paraphernalia of cabinets and other security devices, which I can't afford, and which I'd be unlikely to be able to install in any case (rented accommodation). It's rather like driving - I could probably afford to learn to, and I could probably afford a car, but I couldn't afford to fuel it, tax it, or insure it. Theoretical freedom compromised by practical restrictions. Most frustrating at times.

I'd very much like, if I could acquire one with a good barrel, to have a shoot with a jezail, as I said. Sadly however, that's going to require a lot of hoop-jumping - licensing, storage, Proofing, acquiring a powder license, and then acquiring the powder, as far as I can see. Land of hope and glory, mother of the free, indeed.

Spiral: Thanks for that enlightenment. I had read it was supposedly due to BP being much easier to ignite by heat or naked flame, as well. My opinions on smoking law are a discussion for elsewhere, methinks - wouldn't really fit the forum's rules! ;)

Wow! Id never heard of that! Off to google!

J

No not France, Russia,China & some Muslim states..


Great link on history of tobbaco....

linky on the weed...

spiral

Quite true Jonathan, at least in the public relations end of things. It seems that the political correctness syndrome has swept so many museums and people believe that shielding the public from these 'deadly things' will prevent violence. Actually here in the U.S. the interest in weapons does remain quite prevalent, but with the unbelievable expense of authentic antiques and fakes running rampant, it seems reproductions are more the mainstay.
It is true however that in my huge family with kids, legions of nieces and nephews, and my grandkids, none consider my fascination with historic weapons as anything but weird. There was a ray of light though with one of my nephews who my brother informed me was intrigued by knives. He is quite young, but I gave him an old theatrical knights sword, which will be kept for him but it will be his, his eyes lit up as he saw his fascination with tales of knights and medieval times became real.

I saw exactly what I felt when I would hold a patinated, worn and often broken old sword which I had researched and found key regimental marks linking it distinctly to historical events I had long studied. Here was a piece of that history which had been there in 'real time'! These arms are the very sentinels of history, and long to tell us thier stories, if we will only take the time to seek the questions and answers.

That is why I have studied this obsessively most of my life, and my goal has always been to remind not just collectors, but the public at large, that these arms were far more than simple deadly 'tools' but the very iconic fiber of entire cultures, groups, tribes, Faiths, and patriots.

I know most of us well understand this, and thankfully here we strive to research these arms, discover and preserve thier history, well deserved in being held with that of the people who used them.

All the best,
Jim

Interesting thread, I have wondered this myself when attending arms fairs.

I'm 39 and have had an interest in weaponry for the last 20 years or so. I know a few others of my age who have an interest, but none who are collectors.

Given the prices often involved in collecting I have thought that to be a determining factor in the ages of collectors. I have an average salary job but no kids or pets and don't go on expensive holidays and I can only afford the occasional piece here and there, and then those will be towards the bottom of the market. This is due to the cost of living, having a mortgage etc sapping all my earning before I can spend them on lovely shiny pointy things.

I'm also fortunate that my fiancée shares my interest in arms and armour, albeit not quite to the same level as me. If I had more outgoings and a missus less interested in my hobby I would imagine that I wouldn't be much of a collector myself. As it is, most of the time I have to make do with collecting photographs of weapons and books on the subject rather than the real thing.

Perhaps somewhat erroneously, I have assumed that the reason that the majority of collectors are older are that generation has paid off their mortgages and doesn't have any dependants, possibly retired, and therefore has more time and money to lavish on their interests.

It could just be that the older generation has more of a an general interest in history than the younger generation. This certainly seems to be true of my colleagues at work, it's difficult to find someone of my years or younger to have a decent conversation with!

Too Old
 

Well in a few months It'll be 74. Older but certainly no wiser. Love finding out about various weapons. You guys. have all helped with My quest.

Regards, Steve

Not so fast, Jonathan ;)
You must widen your search; quite a few nations to pick.
I wouldn't wish to go off topic :o .
Just give you a couple tips: Persian shah Abbas-Sofi (1590) death penalty for those found chewing tobacco leaves; Shogun Tokugawa ( XVII century) 50 days hard labour for tobacco smokers; Turkey (XVII century) ears and nose ripped off; Tzar Russia (XVII century) off to Siberia or death penalty.

Lady Members here also
 

Pleased to see the thread is "back on track". :)
I think that Shimmerxxx's post hits the nail on the head. Over the years the price of antique weapons has increased hugely, cost of living has gone up, and the economic situation worldwide has steadily got worse. All this has a bearing on what we collect and what we can AFFORD to collect.Certainly a partner/wife who also takes an interest, is a huge help to the man who collects.
DON'T FORGET THAT WE ALSO HAVE LADY MEMBERS HERE.
I suspect that age may not be as easily published :D , but time the Lady has been collecting would be of interest.
Regards Stu

Cost is the main reason many do not indulge an interest in antique arms I think. Most people I know find my collection interesting - but are somewhat staggered by the investment it takes. It takes a fair bit of sacrifice for most of us I would guess to put the money into this hobby. On the plus side I like putting my spare cash into something that will be around for years and years.

[QUOTE=fernando]Not so fast, Jonathan ;)
You must widen your search;QUOTE]

I thought I would point those interested in the right direction to the well... :D

Glad it quenched your thirst Fernando!

Back to the topic..... Sorry for an interuption to your normal service!

J

I know some young collectors with a lot more money than me, just if there under 40 they dont seem to collect weapons......

Just old moter bikes, rare guitars, cameras, certan watches... stuff like that.

/j

I'm 48 - I've had a long time interest in weapons since my younger days as martial artist and then fencer (not hard to see why I like swords). I got my first replica katana at 21 but then it was many years before I could afford to venture into antique weapons (for all the reasons mentioned by others), probably started actually seriously studying and collecting about 5 years ago. Seems like when I was young I could actually use the things, in the intervening years I had neither time nor money, and now I can't use them I can start to afford nice old weapons :)

Hello all!! Interesting Thread. Don't know how I missed the earlier Posts?
I am 62. My first item was a machete I paid $3.50 for in 1959.
I do have a few blades in my collection, but mostly firearms. I have both original and custom made replicas that I collect and shoot. American, European, and Ethnographic. I belong to a local (33 miles away) private gun club.
My main area of interest is Ethnographic firearms. I've wanted a Moroccan Snaphaunce since I was about 14 years old, but never did anything about it. Well, about 45 years later, I now own two. One in shooting condition and the other will be sometime next year. I own a variety of Moroccan, Algerian, Turkish, Persian, Indian, Afghan, etc. pistols and long arms. My favorite pass time is refurbishing these Ethnographic firearms into safe shooting condition. I've only Posted a couple of these refurbished pieces here on the Forum. I guess I should Post some more. By early Summer, 2013 I should have a large variety of these guns completed. A friend has talked me into doing a series of You-Tube type videos with me actually shooting these guns. Even loading with original flasks/horns.
I guess I've been collecting since I was about 12 years old. What I call my collecting hobby, my late wife called a disease. Of which there is no known cure. :D Now, if my bank account can only keep up with me. :rolleyes:
It is such a pleasure to be a member of this Forum. Rick.

Without doing an actual calculation i'd say we seem to be averaging somewhere in the 50s. :)

I welcome this suggestion!! :D :D ;)

I also hope that those rarest of Weapon collectors *hushed tone*
"The Ladies!" Will also join in with the thread.

As Jonathan says, weapon ownership in the UK is somewhat frowned upon and after many years of misrepresentation of collectable (those no longer usable or intended to be used) weapons by the media, many people sadly do seem to see those who 'still' collect them as being in some way either aggressive or maladjusted.

Many small 'traders' shy away from any weapons here now (even edged ones). They are sometimes 'unsure' of the overly complex laws surrounding weapon ownership and many venues won't allow their sale anyway.

Which takes us onto 'what attracted us' to collecting these cultural icons.
When I was a child, I grew up on a diet of Zorro, the Three Musketeers, Robin Hood.
I went to school and was taught about history including the Empires and wars, the great battles and pivotal moments where history's great cultures and ideologies clashed.
When I was a child I loved my toy swords and guns.
I remember my father making me a wooden sword when I was about four years old and how I treasured that sword as it didn't buckle like the hollow plastic 'crusader swords' that could be bought in Woolworths!

But these were different times! Even in the 1970s/80s you would often see swords on peoples walls. Pub 'decor' was not complete without a sword or two hanging on the wall or a muzzle loader over the fire.

But then something changed.
It took a while but the end result was quite profound.
The emphasis in teaching history in schools was moved to economic and social history.
The laws on edged weapons were tightened and tightened further still.
And 'anti social behaviour' was linked to all manner of causes including violence on TV, violent play in children, toys, video games etc, etc...
But I think most importantly, weapon ownership (that was deemed to be 'without good cause') was made 'illegitimate' in the minds of the general public.
Over the years, people have asked me "Why" do I "need" to own these weapons?
Which makes me wonder whether they would ask a collector of antique porcelain dolls 'why?' they 'need' to own toys that they will never 'play' with?
Or a coin collector why they would own money they would never spend?

As though the lack of ability to use an antique weapon for it’s primary purpose invalidates it’s historic 'worth' as an item.

Which leads the rambling waters of my river of thought to my next point.
I think that the cultural connection to the blade has been severed in the UK.

I can’t imagine anyone questioning the mental stability of a collector of nihonto in Japan! But the sword is every bit as iconic an item to European culture as to Japanese, in fact I could easily argue that it is MORE important to European history and culture!

So is blade ownership in the UK or more specifically the once widespread appreciation of vintage and antique blades now destined to join the category of ‘nostalgia collectables’ as in the main the collectors are those brought up with what is now an anachronistic appreciation of them, and as such we are a diminishing 'breed'?

Do British collectors any longer have any natural successors to bequeath their collections to?
Or are ’we’ destined to become the next set of ’old boys’ with their train-set dioramas in the attic? Or like collectors of ‘tin plate toys’ and nobody who wants to inherit them?
If so it will be the foreign collectors who save the value of our items, but many will eventually end up going overseas.

Sorry for rambling on. Thanks to anyone who stuck with it this far!

...hmm all things that they can show off in public to impress the ladies.

The only attention from the fairer sex I'd get showing off my latest acquisitions would be a policewoman with a taser.

But yes, there does seem to be a misunderstanding in the media about us, and that makes it hard talking about our hobby outside of like minded company.


And excellent post Atlantia, you had many good things to say there.

Very accurate, conscise & well worded statement of the issue Gene...

I see your point shimmer, but by the same token I ve found women a lot more accepting of a few walls covererd in kukris ,swords & knives then most "modern" men... The women go O wow hes a real bloke into that sort of stuff..& accept it easily.Where some men go, O wow hes got things that can kill people.. {read subtext ..me..}.. & due to thier own insecuraties feel threatend..

Girlies seem to accecpt my hobbies... soft lads feel threatend... :in my expierience...shrug:

Spiral

Hi Gene,
To follow on from your deliberations a selection of T.V. programmes shown at 5 p.m. weekdays when I was a lad. Things were definitely different in those days. I remember vividly as an adjunct to our History lessons our teacher arranged to take us to Kelvingrove Museum and once there the class was taken down into the basement and given a lecture on Medieval Arms and Armour complete with the curator dressed in a suit of armour handing round actual weapons for us to look at, I was 9 years old, happy days. The Museum used to be 'chock a block' with A&A including an Ethnographic Hall, now there is one small gallery upstairs for everything. It is very sad as Kelvingrove has one of the best collections in the World mostly in storage now. It seems anachronistic to me that movies and games are so much more violent and visually graphic these days and yet historical A&A is hidden away and shunned like a leper. As a kid everybody had a 'tin hat' and a bayonet or two with badges, patches and the like, I suppose this was more due to the period being in the first few decades after the war and these things were readily available at not a lot of money and no stigma attached to collecting these objects. My mother always knew what kind of movie was on at the local cinema on a Saturday afternoon as the children, me included, would be coming up the road fencing, pulling bows or drawing six guns all imaginary of course the game continuing all week until the next Saturday and another visit to the cinema. Both my children, boy and girl, played with wooden swords, "By the power of Greyskull", and toy guns and when old enough an air rifle and pistol, amongst other things of course, and neither of them are raging sword swinging gun toting bampots in direct contradiction to what some would have us believe. There are some young and energetic collectors in our Forum Family and hopefully they will keep the flame going and if there are any more out there who are interested JOIN IN you don't have to spend a fortune to have an interesting time here.
My Regards,
Norman.

Absolutely beautifully written and perfectly said Gene!!!
It is great to learn more on all of us and how we became 'afflicted' :)
As for the ladies, it is remarkable and fantastic to have a wife who understands, tolerates or best of all participates in this 'hobby'. It took me three ex wives and my wife now is fantastic at listening to my ramblings...I dont collect anymore so that is not an issue.

I would point out that we have some wonderfully knowledgeable and outstanding ladies with us, Tatyana and Cathy who visits occasionally and I think there are others. There have been some great references and articles written by women who are great arms scholars as well, so actually our interest in arms is hardly gender sensitive, and gratefully so.

All the best,
Jim

Great points Norman, the only thing more violent than the movies and games these days is the news....yet the now archaic historic weapons of yesteryear are stored away out of public view for fear of disturbing or offending?

All the best,
Jim

When the names are mentioned one cannot hide anymore :) Great posts boys!
I am 39; toy arms were my best toys as I was growing up in the former Soviet Union: a self-made bow, a wooden Gladius and a wooden Indian rifle that my father has made for me. I was dreaming of real swords of course, but possession of arms was strictly forbidden. Moving to Germany 12 years ago, where acquiring of arms is both affordable and acceptable, has made my dream come true.
I am working in a small computer company (about 25 persons), and two young men there (about 30 years old) collect antique swords as well. My 6 years old son really loves his wooden swords and takes them with him when walking around :) There is still hope after all :)

Hello peeps,
It seems I fall into the average age group! I'm 43 and have been involved with ethnic bits and bobs since a wee boy. my father was a cabinet maker and on accasion took antiques as part payment for work undertaken-my mother was not always so keen on this practise! My partner in collecting karina has been a keen lover of Indian weapons for several years and has it must be said caught the weapons bug-she's a younger 40 years old.

We buy and sell antique to help pay for our interest, it solves the money problem and allows us to own if only for a short time a wide variety of weapons and artifacts.

This is a wondeful thread, very cool to put ages to names...perhaps character profiles next............. :D !!

What is funny is the misconceptions we had regarding peoples ages, perceived youngsters are older, whilst the ageing wise ones are mere youths! It just shows never buy unseen! :D

Cheers to all. A & K

I'm 53 years old and I've been collecting since the early 90's.

Although I must say that I've always been interested in knives and this from my early childhood. When we went on schooltrips (e.g. to the Zoo), I always came back with a small tourist penknife. Now, I wished I kept these. :shrug:

Well, I am not sure about people losing interest in either history or historical items. Certainly there are plenty who are interested, but life is getting harder and other hobbies fill the vacuum easily and far cheaper.

I always liked swords since my childhood. But I was never able to collect so early so was satisfied with just drawing or designing swords. With time I forgot how much I liked swords, but I still would watch documentaries or read any information about them, just never thought of collecting them (there were some tries, where I would save and buy some Chinese made katana or a Syrian made ardha saif. But I knew these arent real and never gave it much attention) but only when I travelled to Greece in 2009 and visiting the military museum there did I get the bug back once again. When I went home, I bought my first 'real' sword and ever since I started collecting AND studying the field more seriously.

When it comes to jambiyas, my first real one was actually given to me as a gift from my uncle, he got it from his wife's family who live in Yemen. Its nothing fancy but an authentic dress piece non the less. Its one of the reasons why I developed an interest into Yemeni (and Arabian) daggers as a whole.

Sometimes I feel alone here when it comes to our hobby. There are people interested but not many willing to spend the cash on it. almost 4 years have passed and I have only met one Kuwaiti collector who is just a mere beginner, I rarely even hear from him. Saqir is another, he used to be in the forum but he no longer is interested in collecting swords though.

I reckon that we collectors are perhaps a part of why the hobby is not so wide spread, ofcourse that can be good and bad at the same time, but wouldnt the fact that we as 'private' collectors are a reason of holding historical items from the public? museums from what I read here seem to have an effect on alot of us which drove us to collect but as time passes and the more we collect, the more of history goes private for decades with only a selected (or overly interested) minority gets to view it.

Some people I know who tried to pick up the hobby felt crushed by the amount of fakes around. They never recovered from their mistakes and simply gave up on the hobby all together. Its their mistake though :-)

Museums are a double edged sword in this regard - yes some exhibit ethnographic arms and do it very well. Unfortunately most museums do not have the space to exhibit all their collections and a great many objects are never available for the public to view.

On subject of fakes - I think it very much depends on the area one collects in. Personally my area of interest doesn't have fakes per say - just things that are less old. :)

While there are many expensive cultures and types to collect there remain quite a few areas where things are still pretty cheap. To be totally honest that's one of the main reasons I got into takouba in the first place - it didn't require a huge investment to acquire a few examples.

I am 48 years , I have been collecting for about 10 years

antoine

I am 50, and I have been collecting and trading things since very early in life.

n2s