Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   Is this an "old man's hobby"? (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=16421)

KuKulzA28 23rd November 2012 09:08 PM

22 currently.

I like history and martial arts, and it led me to collecting antique weapons. But I am not much of a collector... I buy, enjoy it for a bit, and then sell to recuperate the cost. So I'm not big on collecting, due to a combination of cost, taking up space, and not really using them.... but they are very nice.

Timo Nieminen 23rd November 2012 09:52 PM

45. I'm a martial-arts oriented collector, weapons as objects of use, rather than objects of art. So I have modern replicas, mass-produced military edged weapons, and ethnographic weapons. Some stuff purely as art, but that's a spin-off from the main "user" collection.

Andrew 24th November 2012 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara
Oo, oo - what kind of martial arts?

lol.

ITF Taekwon-do
Chung Do Kwon
Muay Thai
Western boxing
Submission wrestling (w/a little BJJ)

Timo Nieminen 25th November 2012 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew
ITF Taekwon-do
Chung Do Kwon
Muay Thai
Western boxing
Submission wrestling (w/a little BJJ)

Wot? No weapons?

ITF TKD
Liechtenauer, mostly longsword
Chinese spear
Chinese archery

In the past, foil fencing and SCA heavy if you call those martial arts.

Atlantia 25th November 2012 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew
lol.

Submission wrestling (w/a little BJJ)

Keep it clean! ;)

Battara 25th November 2012 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew
lol.

ITF Taekwon-do
Chung Do Kwon
Muay Thai
Western boxing
Submission wrestling (w/a little BJJ)

Wow! Nice! Thank you Andrew.

I did Tae Kwon do once, then Shotokan, then Judo, then Chinese Kenpo, an intro to Winchun and an intro to Arnis/Escrima. I am currently working on American Kenpo (with a small mixture of other stuff).

Also I got started collecting in my mid-twenties right after I got married.

My first piece was a Nazi SA dagger, but soon ditched that and got into pieces from the Philippines (and a few other countries).

Atlantia 25th November 2012 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norman McCormick
Hi Gene,
To follow on from your deliberations a selection of T.V. programmes shown at 5 p.m. weekdays when I was a lad. Things were definitely different in those days. I remember vividly as an adjunct to our History lessons our teacher arranged to take us to Kelvingrove Museum and once there the class was taken down into the basement and given a lecture on Medieval Arms and Armour complete with the curator dressed in a suit of armour handing round actual weapons for us to look at, I was 9 years old, happy days. The Museum used to be 'chock a block' with A&A including an Ethnographic Hall, now there is one small gallery upstairs for everything. It is very sad as Kelvingrove has one of the best collections in the World mostly in storage now. It seems anachronistic to me that movies and games are so much more violent and visually graphic these days and yet historical A&A is hidden away and shunned like a leper. As a kid everybody had a 'tin hat' and a bayonet or two with badges, patches and the like, I suppose this was more due to the period being in the first few decades after the war and these things were readily available at not a lot of money and no stigma attached to collecting these objects. My mother always knew what kind of movie was on at the local cinema on a Saturday afternoon as the children, me included, would be coming up the road fencing, pulling bows or drawing six guns all imaginary of course the game continuing all week until the next Saturday and another visit to the cinema. Both my children, boy and girl, played with wooden swords, "By the power of Greyskull", and toy guns and when old enough an air rifle and pistol, amongst other things of course, and neither of them are raging sword swinging gun toting bampots in direct contradiction to what some would have us believe. There are some young and energetic collectors in our Forum Family and hopefully they will keep the flame going and if there are any more out there who are interested JOIN IN you don't have to spend a fortune to have an interesting time here.
My Regards,
Norman.

Absolutely mate.
Although your pictoral examples are all middle aged men with weapons, so they do perpetuate the steryotype somewhat ;)

I've had an interest in knives since childhood.
I remember being on holiday in Jersey at age 7 or 8 and using my spending money to but a sheath knife (yes really) while my parents backs were turned!
It was a different time. The shop keeper just said "are you sure your dad said it's ok?"
Then when I was about 10/11 a family friend let me fire a flintlock dueller in his garage!
Click, fizzzzzzzz................ BOOOMMMM!!!! LOL

And I was hooked from that moment.

EDIT: My mother took the knife away and said I couldn't have it back until I was 11!
I got it back at 10! (yay)

Atlantia 25th November 2012 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timo Nieminen
Wot? No weapons?

ITF TKD
Liechtenauer, mostly longsword
Chinese spear
Chinese archery

In the past, foil fencing and SCA heavy if you call those martial arts.


Martial art's don't get any purer than Fencing!
Makes me wish I still had two ankles made of bone :shrug:

Atlantia 25th November 2012 01:37 AM

My collection has waxed and waned over the years.
I've always been of the opinion that if circumstances demand the sacrifice of the collection then that's OK.
Several times I've been forced to liquidate my collections entirely.
Thankfully I live in a country where there is no shortage of things to spend money on when circumstances allow.
We are custodians of these items for a short time. We keep them for a while, preserve and even at times restore, then they are passed to the next person. It's all part of their story.
They pre-date us and will outlive us. So we are just a small part of their story.
My collection now is probobly as good as it's ever been, but it's an evolving thing.
It's difficult to directly compare it with 'high points of the past'.
I still miss some of the items I've owned in the past. But It's more diverse now than it's ever been.
I decided a few years ago when I wanted to appear more 'rounded' to "Mrs Atlantia" that I'd soften the 'theme' with some associated items.
http://s25.photobucket.com/albums/c5...view=slideshow
I find now that I enjoy some of these items as much as the weapons.

TVV 25th November 2012 02:28 AM

I am 31. I started with a souvenir knife from a trip to Turkey when I was 14, if that counts as a beginning.

kronckew 25th November 2012 06:21 AM

i'm admitting to 65 at the moment.

ignoring the odd pocket knife, i started with buying my sword when i was commissioned in 1968 at 20, closely followed by asking john eck to make me a knife. connecting to the internet a number of years ago has made it easier to acquire new ethnic pretties.

i did have a keen interest in historical fiction and was captain of the new york state university maritime college epee team in my senior year, fencing for the 4 years i spent as a cadet there, which helped prejudice me in favour of sharp pointy things. and bludgeons.

manteris1 25th November 2012 04:39 PM

hi guys, i'm 70,and been collecting for 50yrs......................jimmy

Dom 26th November 2012 09:09 AM

how I've been able to ignore this fantastic post? :o
I am almost 71, and my passion for weapons and armor back to ...
as far as I can remember when I was really a kid

in my mountains in South-Western France, too many castles, too many legends,
all dating back to the Middle Ages, that's made me a lot dreaming, and even a dreamer
our tradition is to always have in our pocket, our traditional knife, a "Laguiole" I had mine, as gift for my 10 years
then at school, my favorite pastime was to draw; helmets, swords, sabers
my first collection has been constituted of firearms, then, due to hardening regulations and the vagaries of life,
I have sold everything :rolleyes:

I restarted to collect edged weapons in the 80's when I went to the Middle East, as x-pat,
since I'm married to an "Arabist" younger than me by 10 years,
who share my passion for Islamic weapons and armor,
she is your translator for your Arabic inscriptions :p

I've a nephew, here in Egypt (among ... many others :eek: )
to who I've offered this year a "short flissa" and
a book (in French) concerning the Islamic edged weapons, he is absolutely crazy for edged weapons ...
to help him to identify the knifes it would have to see ;)

thank you for Atlantia to have initiated this post :D

ā +

Dom

Maskell 26th November 2012 02:55 PM

hi guys, i'm 70,and been collecting for 50yrs......................Jerry

Actually I cut & past Jimmy's reply as my info is exactly the same.

Jim McDougall 26th November 2012 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manteris1
hi guys, i'm 70,and been collecting for 50yrs......................jimmy

Brief and modest as always. Jimmy I have always thought of as the true gentleman collector, and how polite and patient his demeanor always remained in the times we met and talked.
My favorite was the year in Baltimore when he was to deliver a talk on the Ethiopian shotels, but to his chagrin he had sold the examples he had brought for demonstration at the show that day! :) Truly one of those 'Kodak moments' when he , in his ever gentle manner, asked if there was anyone in the room who had a shotel he could use for a few minutes.

Jim McDougall 26th November 2012 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom
how I've been able to ignore this fantastic post? :o
I am almost 71, and my passion for weapons and armor back to ...
as far as I can remember when I was really a kid

in my mountains in South-Western France, too many castles, too many legends,
all dating back to the Middle Ages, that's made me a lot dreaming, and even a dreamer
our tradition is to always have in our pocket, our traditional knife, a "Laguiole" I had mine, as gift for my 10 years
then at school, my favorite pastime was to draw; helmets, swords, sabers
my first collection has been constituted of firearms, then, due to hardening regulations and the vagaries of life,
I have sold everything :rolleyes:

I restarted to collect edged weapons in the 80's when I went to the Middle East, as x-pat,
since I'm married to an "Arabist" younger than me by 10 years,
who share my passion for Islamic weapons and armor,
she is your translator for your Arabic inscriptions :p

I've a nephew, here in Egypt (among ... many others :eek: )
to who I've offered this year a "short flissa" and
a book (in French) concerning the Islamic edged weapons, he is absolutely crazy for edged weapons ...
to help him to identify the knifes it would have to see ;)

thank you for Atlantia to have initiated this post :D

ā +

Dom

Dom,
While I feel safe to say we are all a bit romantics and dreamers, you have always seemed to me a true adventurer, and I admire the way you thoughtfully nurture this young mans interest. You do so very much in the way you add your astute observations and wonderfully detailed translation assistance to help us all better understand these weapons.

All the best,
Jim

Iliad 26th November 2012 07:48 PM

Aged 71; started collecting about 12 years ago. Collecting edged weapons seems to be an incurable disease. Is there any way out?
But I have made so many friends!
Brian

Andrew 26th November 2012 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timo Nieminen
Wot? No weapons?

ITF TKD
Liechtenauer, mostly longsword
Chinese spear
Chinese archery

In the past, foil fencing and SCA heavy if you call those martial arts.

No formal weapons training--mostly just wasters and "test cutting" for fun.

:)

Andrew 26th November 2012 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlantia
Keep it clean! ;)

lol :D

Andrew 26th November 2012 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara
Wow! Nice! Thank you Andrew.

I did Tae Kwon do once, then Shotokan, then Judo, then Chinese Kenpo, an intro to Winchun and an intro to Arnis/Escrima. I am currently working on American Kenpo (with a small mixture of other stuff).

Also I got started collecting in my mid-twenties right after I got married.

My first piece was a Nazi SA dagger, but soon ditched that and got into pieces from the Philippines (and a few other countries).

Funny how guys like us who "taste" many different styles used to be denigrated--these days, MMA has made it de rigueur.

I still train my core art, and always will, however...

Andrew 26th November 2012 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlantia
Martial art's don't get any purer than Fencing!
Makes me wish I still had two ankles made of bone :shrug:

Agreed.

A. G. Maisey 27th November 2012 12:32 AM

Andrew, may I request a clarification, please?

In your post #100 you tell us that MMA has made the mixing of a number of styles of martial arts "de rigueur".

I am not a martial artist, in fact for a long time I've been a firm believer in the wisdom of Sun Tsu, however I did have a little involvement in some physical combat during my misspent youth, and this has resulted in an ongoing interest in martial arts in general.

It is my understanding that perhaps the most effective art overall is BJJ, with the best foundation for MMA being traditional wrestling --- I won't nominate a particular style, but I feel that possibly greco-roman might be the most effective base, simply because of its artificial restraints, which militate a chess-like approach to competition.

You clearly have a far greater knowledge in this area than do I, as well as the benefit of being an active participant, so do you think you could explain for me how multi skilling in a variety of arts contributes to success in MMA?

I do follow this spasmodically, and from what I can see it is mostly wrestlers with a few added in BJJ skills who have dominated overall, except for the early years when it was all BJJ.

But I do not have your knowledge nor your experience, so perhaps I'm wrong.

This is well and truly off-topic, so if you wish respond privately, or direct me to a website, I'm fine with that.

Thanks, Alan.

Andrew 27th November 2012 02:50 PM

OT martial arts discussion continued here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...730#post148730

Sunmit 28th November 2012 06:04 AM

I am 27 and started seriously collecting about 6 years ago. The cost of antiques is definitely a factor that leaves me just saving photos of things in my wish list folder :)

To be honest talking to the folks that have been in the indo persian collecting world at shows has been the best part about all of this - being comparatively sort of young I get to hear a lot of awesome stories, suggestions etc from those that have been doing this for than 20+ years.

Definitely cherish meeting everyone once a year at the baltimore show as well, its always an awesome experience.

spiral 28th November 2012 10:25 PM

So in England at least it appears at least a middle aged if not old mans hobby,,

Possibly heading that way in US of A as well...

Some young blood elsewhere is good to see though,;)

Spiral

chregu 29th November 2012 04:18 PM

hello together
my first piece, bought at a flea market in Rotterdamm. one Madura keris for 90 Gulden.
I was with my parents on vacation in Holand. I was 17 years old, now I'm 45 years
chregu

olikara 2nd December 2012 09:25 AM

I'm 37 now.

And to be honest, would not have branched out into collecting edged arms had it not been for this forum and Jim McDougall.

Atlantia 2nd December 2012 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by olikara
I'm 37 now.

And to be honest, would not have branched out into collecting edged arms had it not been for this forum and Jim McDougall.

Hi Olikara,

Collecting can end up being a 'solitary' pursuit, we are often buying at distance, not to mention that we are buying items that are no longer considered mainstream 'collectables'. In fact many dealers and collectors consider them 'offensive weapons'!
Also of course the marketplace can seem a tad 'dog eat dog' at times to say the very least.
It can make collectors isolated and wary.

Even online forums and resources have various types of participants.

The machiavellian traders who exploit the resource without sharing their own knowledge.

The 'timid' or shy collectors who feel uncomfortable in giving opinions that might disagree with others. The occasional contributors.

The 'bread and butter' collectors and dealers who through passion for the field both share their knowledge and recieve help from others. (a good forum will hopefully have a majority of these people, the 'give and take' group)

But there are a few, who simply give.
The true 'researchers'. The historians and seekers whose joy is simply in the quest for knowledge and the opportunity to help and inspire others.
A very rare group in any sphere!

Jim is one of these rare people.
He gives freely of his time, his huge experience and wealth of knowledge never asking anything in return.

How could anyone who is fortunate enough to know 'our' Jim, not be inspired by him?

Our own wandering oracle of wisdom.

asomotif 21st April 2020 12:39 PM

Strange how the mind wanders. It must be old age ;) , and/or the social distancing / mild lock down in my country.

Are there any new "old men" around ? Hence bumping this "old" thread...

Stay safe !

Best regards,
Willem

JBG163 21st April 2020 01:01 PM

29 here !
Started collecting only one years ago, by purchasing a modest keris then a Kora.
But let's say the truth... that a real frenzy thing...

corrado26 21st April 2020 02:11 PM

I'm aged 75, am collecting lots of different things since more than 60 years now and am writing articles for arms magazines more than 40 years.

Rafngard 21st April 2020 04:16 PM

When I first joined this forum 3.5 or so years ago, I meant to post here, but I never got around to it.

39 here, looking at forty later this year. Hopefully the world opens back up before then. Martial arts (and job promotion that came with more disposable income) got me started, the membership of this forum has kept me at it.

I'm grateful to all the old (or not) men (and women) who post here.

Cheers,
Leif

Will M 21st April 2020 04:20 PM

I am 59, ouch! Seems it was just a few years ago I began collecting but it's been decades ago. Mostly British pattern cavalry swords with infantry sneaking in there because swords with provenance are most interesting.
I find militaria shows where I am, Toronto, Ottawa etc. do not draw the percentage of people I would expect, only about 0.01%

Araņa_del_Sol 21st April 2020 04:26 PM

I'm 33, been collecting since I was 21

Athanase 21st April 2020 04:44 PM

Hello,
I'm 34 year old.
I started my Indonesian weapons collection with a Mandau from the 1960s in 2013

Blacksmith 21st April 2020 07:30 PM

48 and start collecting indo-persian stuff in 2003 when living in India.Found an old katar in Kathmandu, that was the first piece.Before that I collect finnish puukko- knives, I got my own puukko when I was six years old and in the same summer cut my fore finger badly when carving a wooden ship.Mother was angry with my father but he just said that wounds are part of the learning proces..Well, he was right, dont cut myself anymore after 42 years of learning..So collecting practically whole life.

kahnjar1 21st April 2020 09:12 PM

I see that I last posted to this thread 8 years ago! Time just seems to fly by.
All locked down here for last 4 weeks and we have 2 weeks more to go before things are eased up, so plenty of time to "service" my current collection.
Have been collecting for about 55years and am now a healthy 76.
If membership of our local Antique Arms Assn Branch is anything to go by, then YES it is more an "old man's" hobby. Very few young ones coming thru...............but at least here on the Forum there seem to be new/younger Members to keep things alive.
Keep safe during very tough times.
Stu

shayde78 22nd April 2020 12:30 AM

41 years old here. I've had an interest in collecting for as long as I can remember, stretching all the way back to before the turn of the century, back in the 1900s (remember those days when oil cost something per barrel). I've only had the means to indulge my interest and truly start collecting for about 4 years.
I do think the price point for collecting keeps younger folks from getting involved. I think some rigid gender norms around discouraging young girls' interest in weapons keeps women from being well represented in this hobby. However, this forum has a role in breaking down some of these patterns and welcoming everyone with an interest in the subject.
Stay safe and healthy, everyone!

xasterix 22nd April 2020 01:54 AM

I'm turning 34 soon. I started collecting modern Filipino blades 2 years ago, but eventually added old blades. The old blades are a wonder to wield and cut with.

Rafngard 22nd April 2020 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xasterix
I'm turning 34 soon. I started collecting modern Filipino blades 2 years ago, but eventually added old blades. The old blades are a wonder to wield and cut with.

Everytime I see one of your cutting videos, I feel inspired.
Once this pandemic is all over, and bottled water is normal price again, I'm going to buy a flat of them, get a couple of my old ones polished/sharpened, and give it a go.

Have fun (since I certainly will),
Leif


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