Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   Frontier cuirass c. 1720 believed Pueblo Indian in Spanish Style (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=30567)

TVV 30th October 2025 09:57 PM

While I sadly did not take a picture of the museum label, from what I recall from close to 10 years ago when I took the picture is that this armor was from Mexico, and was parade in function. I could stand to be corrected on this.

Jim McDougall 30th October 2025 11:14 PM

This is a quandry!! Seems like there was some elaborate deity of worship through the Meso American history Olmec, Aztecs, Mayans which had the feathered serpent god Quetzalcoatl......possibly this was indeed a parade costume.
The notion of the feathering is compelling in suggestion to the lamellar armor we're looking at, but of course speculative as similar type of armor were in use in Europe in much earlier times.

Thanks very much for sharing the pics! Those adarga shields are REALLY hard to find, last one I saw was BAVIA and was in use in the Alamo context.

TVV 1st November 2025 06:29 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Jim, here is another adarga, currently exhibited in the Carmel Mission in Carmel, CA, which belonged to a soldier in Portola's expedition. It is interesting to see they were still used in the New World in the second half of the 18th century.

Jim McDougall 15th November 2025 07:57 PM

Once again, to clarify, my efforts here in posting this intriguing leather armor have been to either support the suggested Spanish/Pueblo origin of this most unusual cuirass , or to acknowledge the suggestion that this is in fact Filipino armor, to which little evidence has been forthcoming.

While the most esoteric example noted to have belonged to a former colleague here named Mabadgani, per Jose, is compelling, it seems a most rare form.
As has been discussed, Moro armor is typically of mail, and plates made of various material, including carabou (water buffalo) horn and follows the typical Muslim form (including zirah bakhtar, from Sindh, in India) which opens in front.

While this feature of course is not defining, it is compelling.

If this example is indeed Filipino as suggested, it would appear to be one of the rarest examples seen as per the dearth of such examples known.

The newly revealed fact that this armor was actually acquired at auction in California in 1957, does align with possible provenance from the volumes of souvenir items brought back from the Spanish-American war. However, the evidence considered from previous research regarding possible provenance to Pueblo circumstances in New Mexico as noted remains compelling as well, so as they say....the jury is still out!

Jim McDougall 15th November 2025 11:00 PM

Once again, to clarify, my efforts here in posting this intriguing leather armor have been to either support the suggested Spanish/Pueblo origin of this most unusual cuirass , or to acknowledge the suggestion that this is in fact Filipino armor, to which little evidence has been forthcoming.

While the most esoteric example noted to have belonged to a former colleague here named Mabadgani, per Jose, is compelling, it seems a most rare form.
As has been discussed, Moro armor is typically of mail, and plates made of various material, including carabou (water buffalo) horn and follows the typical Muslim form (including zirah bakhtar, from Sindh, in India) which opens in front.

While this feature of course is not defining, it is compelling.

If this example is indeed Filipino as suggested, it would appear to be one of the rarest examples seen as per the dearth of such examples known.

The newly revealed fact that this armor was actually acquired at auction in California in 1957, does align with possible provenance from the volumes of souvenir items brought back from the Spanish-American war. However, the evidence considered from previous research regarding possible provenance to Pueblo circumstances in New Mexico as noted remains compelling as well, so as they say....the jury is still out!


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